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+-- Thread: Is a jointer useless without a planer? (/showthread.php?tid=7339784)
Is a jointer useless without a planer? - nickm62388 - 05-25-2018
[attachment=10601]I am getting married in November, and have been trying to make things for the wedding out of pallet wood, to save some money. Now I know pallet wood is the absolute worst thing to use to make nice things, but were on a tight budget and I'm trying to make due.
Ive learned that no matter how many times I try different pieces of pallet wood and run it thru jointer, face side first and then the edge (which I do get a perfect 90 degree angle on those two things), I'm never ever able to make 5 identical pieces for a 5 board rectangle piece for a wedding sign (as shown below).
It always comes out to be a wedge, no matter what, therefore being uneven and not flat with other pieces I try to make for the wooden sign
I don't know how people just get by with just a jointer, if they want a perfect parallel piece of wood. I am correct in saying without both a jointer and planer its impossible?
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - Phil Thien - 05-25-2018
I would say jointing is the first step in preparing stock for use, the next steps involve using a planer on the opposite face, and using a table saw on the opposite edge (as jointed).
If you don't mind glue-ups where the back face isn't perfectly even/aligned, though, then you could get away w/o a planer. If you look at a lot of period furniture, you'll see the old masters didn't waste a lot of time flattening wood that didn't show. So the bottoms of tables (for example) could be quite uneven/wavy.
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - daddo - 05-25-2018
I used the jointer to get one good flat surface for the planer or saws.
Is it impossible without a planer? You could use the table saw if the cuts are within the limits of the saw.
Sometimes I would just use the planer to get one flat surface by attaching the rough wood to another flat board and run that through until it too is flat. You can make a wedged piece this way as well.
Some guys here are very handy with hand planers and could do it.
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - Admiral - 05-25-2018
What Phil said.
What you have to understand is that the jointer only creates a flat reference surface on the face of the board, then an edge at 90 deg to that reference surface. You can certainly joint the opposite edge at 90 to the reference surface if you wish. But when you flip the board to the other face, there is nothing that it can reference to, hence your wedge result. What you can do is try and use the edge that is jointed to guide you on the second face, but that is tricky. Otherwise, you can flatten the other face with a hand plane, which even in the hands of a newbie will give you better results than trying to use the jointer, and if its relatively flat after hand planing, you could put it on the jointer for a pass or two to clean it up. These two options are less than optimal, so eventually you'd want a planer, so be on the lookout on CList for used lunchbox planers, I saw one in my neck of the woods for $100, but test it under power, if you have patience eventually you'll find a deal.
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - nickm62388 - 05-25-2018
Ya I thought about attempting to joint plane the one face side and then the one edge to get a 90 degree perfect angle, then using a hand planer for the other face side, and then the last edge on a table saw...But the problem is the hand planer is not wide enough for the whole piece of wood. And you cant tell in the picture of the sign I made, but the thing is so hacked up from a hand planer...I glued all the boards together but they were all so uneven and being a newbie,I tried using hand planer to make it all even on top and I messed it up so bad, so many uneven grooves and unevenness lol
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - Derek Cohen - 05-25-2018
Ive learned that no matter how many times I try different pieces of pallet wood and run it thru jointer, face side first and then the edge (which I do get a perfect 90 degree angle on those two things), I'm never ever able to make 5 identical pieces for a 5 board rectangle piece for a wedding sign (as shown below).
It always comes out to be a wedge, no matter what, therefore being uneven and not flat with other pieces I try to make for the wooden sign
I don't know how people just get by with just a jointer, if they want a perfect parallel piece of wood. I am correct in saying without both a jointer and planer its impossible?
Nick, it is about technique as much as experience.
As others have pointed out, a jointer only flattens one side. A planer makes two sides parallel. However, if you are planing a wedge, it is likely that you are applying pressure unevenly. That is experience. Further, if you are chewing up boards with a handplane, then I'm afraid you need to learn to use one. That is technique.
One can use a jointer to flatten one side, then use a bandsaw to resaw it evenly. Do you have a bandsaw?
Alternately, joint one side, and then scribe the desired thickness with a gauge, and plane to the lines. You need a sharp blade, and ability to read the grain.
Regards from Perth
Derek
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - BloomingtonMike - 05-25-2018
Get a flat face, then joint a 90 degree edge, cut those strips to a width less than max height of table saw blade, then thickness those strips on ts, then glue up, then scrape and sand. Be careful.
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - Hank Knight - 05-25-2018
(05-25-2018, 09:06 AM)nickm62388 Wrote: Ya I thought about attempting to joint plane the one face side and then the one edge to get a 90 degree perfect angle, then using a hand planer for the other face side, and then the last edge on a table saw...But the problem is the hand planer is not wide enough for the whole piece of wood. And you cant tell in the picture of the sign I made, but the thing is so hacked up from a hand planer...I glued all the boards together but they were all so uneven and being a newbie,I tried using hand planer to make it all even on top and I messed it up so bad, so many uneven grooves and unevenness lol
Hand planes are the answer. It sounds like you have no experience e with them, so it's no wonder you got bad results. They are not difficult, but there is definitely a learning curve you need to accomplish. Unless you're working with very narrow stock, a hand plane almost never covers the entire width of a workpiece. You have to make multiple passes and learn to apply the tool so you remove the high spots to end up with a flat panel. How you set the plane up is important, but the MOST IMPORTANT thing is sharpening the iron. A friend has this sign posted in hie shop:
HOW TO CORRECT A HAND PLANE THAT IS NOT PERFORMING PROPERLY:
Step #1 - Sharpen the iron.
If that doesn't correct the problem, repeat Step #1.
There's a certain amount of tongue-in-cheek in that rule, but it makes a point. Probably 80% of hand plane problems can be attributed to poorly or improperly sharpened irons.
There's a lot of information on this site about using hand planes, and people here are more than willing to answer questions - and there are no "dumb questions."
Two things to think about:
1. People made a living with hand planes for centuries before electricity, and they produced some of the finest furniture in the world with them. And
2. A good hand plane and a couple of sharpening stones are a lot less expensive than a power planer.
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - nickm62388 - 05-25-2018
Thanks for the input all....I think I was under the impression we have been talking about an electric planer the whole time (which is what I was using on the board shown in picture. The boards were to wide when I used the hand electric planer, so I had to make two passes and thats why they were so uneven, I guess i was using to much pressure between the two passes on one board.
bloomington mike...are you saying to joint the face and edge of one board so its 90 degrees, then put it thru a table saw but standing up rather then laying it down, if so I do not feel comfortable at all doing that
RE: Is a jointer useless without a planer? - daddo - 05-25-2018
Also;
I use edge clamps quite a bit on the table saw for boards with bad edges.
![[Image: live-edge-rip-3.jpg]](http://www.woodworkersjournal.com/wp-content/uploads/live-edge-rip-3.jpg)
Or if you need to trim some off of a decorative sided board that won't run true on the fence.