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+-- Thread: The Generator Lives! (/showthread.php?tid=7326967)
RE: The Generator Lives! - Mr_Mike - 01-30-2017
I'm pretty sure Crockett has a mechanical lock-out installed. If not, we would have already berated him mercilessly.
Thats a good analysis of the heat pump load. I'll have to add that to my "move to Tennessee" notes.
RE: The Generator Lives! - TDKPE - 01-30-2017
(01-29-2017, 05:41 PM)crokett™ Wrote: The only other change I'm going to make is replace the existing starter switch with a push-button one since after the engine starts you have to set the switch back to off position.
Can't you use a convention old-school automotive keyed off/on/start switch, with fuel and ignition connected to the 'on' lug, and the start solenoid to the 'start' momentary lug? Hang the key inside with a big fob so DW knows where it is, and use a transfer switch or lock-out toggle retrofit so nobody can backfeed the grid when forgetting to disconnect the utility connection.
http://www.ebay.com/bhp/universal-ignition-switch
RE: The Generator Lives! - crokett™ - 01-30-2017
(01-30-2017, 10:14 AM)Mr_Mike Wrote: I'm pretty sure Crockett has a mechanical lock-out installed. If not, we would have already berated him mercilessly.
Does "I have it but it's not installed yet" count as installed?
Seriously, I have it, it's in my shop. sitting on the bench. I'll install it this weekend. I wanted to prove it all worked before messing up my panel. It came with phillips screws that need to be loosened to move the lockout tab back and forth. I want to find some thumbscrews so it's tool-less. tom, thanks for the analysis (again) on the heat pump. I did consider an automotive type switch andpicked up a lawnmower ignition switch. the separate swtiches are easier to mount - just drill a 1/2 hole and you're done. at least the ignition switch I got required a much larger hole with notches in it to fit the switch into. I actually started by putting it into a plastic box cover thinking I'd mount a box before deciding to go with the toggle switch. When it's dark, raining, etc the toggle switch and push button can be done by feel.
RE: The Generator Lives! - Mr_Mike - 01-30-2017
A keyless mechanical ignition switch seems like a better idea as the wife would find it more similar to turning on the car. i.e. No training.
RE: The Generator Lives! - Phil Thien - 01-30-2017
Just curious, will the generator trip something should the load exceed capacity?
I guess I'm wondering if whether the heat pump being able to run is a curiosity, or if damage to the generator or heat pump might occur?
RE: The Generator Lives! - Roly - 01-30-2017
Great that it was finally online. Do you have a switch on the gas valve ? Roly
RE: The Generator Lives! - TDKPE - 01-30-2017
(01-30-2017, 12:00 PM)Phil Thien Wrote: I guess I'm wondering if whether the heat pump being able to run is a curiosity, or if damage to the generator or heat pump might occur?
The only question left, in my mind at least, is whether or not it will be able to start, especially with other loads on the system, due to voltage drop at the generator when it's pulling LRA for a fraction of a second it takes to start the compressor.
But there is such a thing as a 'hard-start kit', which despite the ridiculous claims by the vendors about heat generation and extending the life by 10 years and other such nonsense, is actually just a start capacitor and potential relay. From what little I know of these hermetic condenser packages used in HVAC, lately they've been building them with a run capacitor only, whereas old-school units had a dual-value cap or two separate capacitors with relay to cut out the 'start' portion or separate capacitor. New ones (supposedly) don't have a big start cap section, so startup may take longer (due to lower torque available with the non-ideal capacitor value for slow rotor speed - needs to be much larger for starting).
Start capacitors don't 'store' energy to help start the rotor, as the online vendors claim; they just create a bigger time shift between the current in the two windings while the rotor is stopped or moving slowly, and then cut out so the run capacitor only creates a smaller time shift between the two windings when at speed. Exactly like a capacitor-start, capacitor-run motor on most larger single-phase shop tool motors, which are really two-phase motors with the second phase artificially created via capacitor(s).
So a 'hard start kit' may help kick it into gear faster on lower voltage by increasing its starting torque, which can be useful as the voltage of a 10 kilowatt weakling generator is more easily pulled down than the voltage of the gigawatt grid bully. By way of simplification.
But only potentially useful if it's actually needed, and if the system doesn't already have a start capacitor and relay.
RE: The Generator Lives! - crokett™ - 01-30-2017
(01-30-2017, 12:02 PM)Roly Wrote: Great that it was finally online. Do you have a switch on the gas valve ? Roly
Not sure what you mean by switch on the gas valve. There's a manual valve on the line external to the generator. I close that valve when it's off. 2 weeks ago to get it running I jumpered temporary wiring to get power to the fuel solenoid, then jumpered across the legs of the existing start switch so that when that was closed the starter would turn over. This past weekend, I made all the temporary wiring permanent and put a switch on the fuel solenoid. To start it, I turn that switch on, then hit the starter switch. Once the generator is running, to turn it off, I turn off the fuel solenoid, which stops the propane. Then I turn off the external valve. Does that help?
RE: The Generator Lives! - Roly - 01-31-2017
Yes, the fuel solenoid was what I was referring to. Roly