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+-- Thread: Crucible Holdfasts (/showthread.php?tid=7327359)
Crucible Holdfasts - Admiral - 01-27-2017
I came across this video of Chris explaining why these holdfasts are better, and how they were developed. While its a bit of passive/agressive marketing that goes on for over 10 minutes, it was interesting to hear of the process and I appreciate what was done to make them what they are, but at $135 each, somehow even I (who paid $170 for TFWW's saw vice, so we all have our "vices" when it comes to spending dough on tools) would have a hard time justifying $270 for a pair of holdfasts (you can't just have one), versus $35 for a pair of Joel's (and if my bench had 3/4"holes, having to enlarge or drill new ones). Now, I have a bench with 1" dog holes, and there were really no alternatives for me, so I had a pair made by a smithy, which work great, and while not cast ductile iron like Crucible's, they hold the work down just fine.
Has anyone here actually purchased the Crucible version, what was your value add calculation, and how's that worked out? Just wondering. . . . . .
https://crucibletool.com/blogs/news/why-our-holdfasts-are-different
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - Alan S - 01-27-2017
The OD of nominal 3/4" malleable iron pipe of the type used with pipe clamps is a bit over 1". It might be interesting if you have large enough holes in your bench to try attaching a couple of pieces of pipe with either a right angle elbow or a T, and see if that works as a holdfast. There are lots of things to try at the work end, from a simple block of wood drilled, tapped, and screwed on, to another right angle and a flange.
While these might not look good, they would be very cheap (under $5) and I'd be curious if they worked.
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - hbmcc - 01-27-2017
Da-Wow! That's a chunk of dough. Are they guaranteed to work in a Roubo? Yeah, nothing sexy about my TFWW steel--even the S&S gentleman, who may be gone now--but I *can* have them.
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - EricU - 01-27-2017
I thought the hand forged ones were about that much when I looked last. I'm not sure a holdfast will ever make it's way into my workflow. I don't have any holes for them in my bench, for one thing
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - Admiral - 01-27-2017
(01-27-2017, 09:22 PM)DEricU Wrote: I thought the hand forged ones were about that much when I looked last. I'm not sure a holdfast will ever make it's way into my workflow. I don't have any holes for them in my bench, for one thing
Drill some, 3/4", and buy a pair from TFWW. very handy items.
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - Adnick - 01-27-2017
Use the TFWW ones they work fine, but have one hole that a tad too big for them, don't ask why, so I would like to have just one Crucible holdfast but can't even force myself to buy just the one...
Andy -- mos maiorum
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - new cab guy - 01-31-2017
(01-27-2017, 04:23 PM)Steel Guy Wrote: Ductile Cast Iron....for a hold fast...WOW
Given that cast iron expands as it solidifies there is limited/no risk of voids so that it will be strong and at 1" diameter and out of ductile iron there is limited risk for breaking in use.
Historically cast iron hold fasts make sense (except out of grey iron and brittle) as wrought iron would be too soft and steel was too expensive...however in 2017 while they are totally cool, given the price why? Besides the fact that you can (and they are cool)...WHY??
I have a pair of the LN holdfasts that are cast ductile iron and they are wonderful. They work great in my 5" thick mega bench.
The crucible ones look awesome, but it's hard to put down that kind of money for them (from the guy who sprung for the LN ones).
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - wmickley - 02-01-2017
Historical holdfasts were forged, not cast. The reason is because you want spring in the arm of the holdfast. Roubo shows a holdfast which tapers down to 2 lignes, which is less than 3/16 inches. I'm not talking about just the pad; the whole arm tapers. And Roubo says the holdfast should be very flexible, plus elastiques. Other historic sources show holdfasts with tapered arms as well.
I don't think a serious user would want a rough shaft because it would chew up the hole over time.
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - Philip1231 - 02-01-2017
A real metallurgy expert might want to chime in here, but I believe ductile cast iron is way more elastic ("springy") than regular
cast iron, and is "springy " enough to perform well as a holdfast, hence the excellent performance of the LN and other cast ductile iron holdfasts.
I wonder if anyone has bothered to perform an experiment to see what the forces are for the various types of iron/steel holdfasts.
Crucible has certainly found a sub-niche market within the niche market for holdfasts: I'll bet those who are building ever newer (old newly discovered) benches will be the buyers. Hope it works out for them.
RE: Crucible Holdfasts - MattP - 02-01-2017
(02-01-2017, 11:57 AM)Philip1231 Wrote: A real metallurgy expert might want to chime in here, but I believe ductile cast iron is way more elastic ("springy") than regular
cast iron, and is "springy " enough to perform well as a holdfast, hence the excellent performance of the LN and other cast ductile iron holdfasts.
I wonder if anyone has bothered to perform an experiment to see what the forces are for the various types of iron/steel holdfasts.
Crucible has certainly found a sub-niche market within the niche market for holdfasts: I'll bet those who are building ever newer (old newly discovered) benches will be the buyers. Hope it works out for them.
At the risk of sounding like a grade A jerk, I hope it doesn't work out for them. If it works out for them, that'll mean people are actually paying $135 for a holdfast. The market has to punish this sort of thing, otherwise, we all end up (literally) paying the price.