+- Woodnet Forums (https://forums.woodnet.net)
+-- Thread: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? (/showthread.php?tid=7336321)
How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - greatscott - 01-11-2018
I'm making a mantle out of some 4/4 maple and I wanted to veneer both end caps (don't want to see end grain, just face grain). How thin of a veneer can I use? Is 1/8" too thin? I really didn't think this project through when I was designing this out as my original plan was to 45 all the edges and just cap in a 4/4 piece for the ends so it would look seemless but I can no longer do that based upon how I cut the pieces. Just trying to make the ends look nice.
Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Splinter Puller - 01-11-2018
(01-11-2018, 02:11 PM)greatscott Wrote: I'm making a mantle out of some 4/4 maple and I wanted to veneer both end caps (don't want to see end grain, just face grain). How thin of a veneer can I use? Is 1/8" too thin? I really didn't think this project through when I was designing this out as my original plan was to 45 all the edges and just cap in a 4/4 piece for the ends so it would look seemless but I can no longer do that based upon how I cut the pieces. Just trying to make the ends look nice.
Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!
You will probably have wood movement issues with the changes in grain direction. Consider attaching only at the front and using dovetail keys near the back that will allow the mantel to move in and out seperately than the end cap. If your going to hide the endgrain then why waste the wood with a solid mantel? just make a plywood box with veneer on all exposed surfaces.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Cooler - 01-11-2018
The mantle is pretty shallow in most cases. I believe it is fine to glue up about 3½" of face grain to end grain with no issues in most cases. If the mantle is 5" deep, I would just use biscuits and glue for the middle 3½" and let the rest float. Or glue the from 3½" and let the rear float.
If it is much deeper then a sliding dovetail will work in most cases. Just apply glue at the end only. Allow the rest to float.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Splinter Puller - 01-11-2018
What about mitering the ends of entire mantle thickness? You would then not have the issue with the thin veneer showing at the top and bottom.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - greatscott - 01-12-2018
(01-11-2018, 03:11 PM)Splinter Puller Wrote: You will probably have wood movement issues with the changes in grain direction. Consider attaching only at the front and using dovetail keys near the back that will allow the mantel to move in and out seperately than the end cap. If your going to hide the endgrain then why waste the wood with a solid mantel? just make a plywood box with veneer on all exposed surfaces.
(01-11-2018, 03:29 PM)Cooler Wrote: The mantle is pretty shallow in most cases. I believe it is fine to glue up about 3½" of face grain to end grain with no issues in most cases. If the mantle is 5" deep, I would just use biscuits and glue for the middle 3½" and let the rest float. Or glue the from 3½" and let the rear float.
If it is much deeper then a sliding dovetail will work in most cases. Just apply glue at the end only. Allow the rest to float.
(01-11-2018, 03:45 PM)Splinter Puller Wrote: What about mitering the ends of entire mantle thickness? You would then not have the issue with the thin veneer showing at the top and bottom.
Sorry, I did not post a picture as originally intended.
https://flic.kr/p/23otxkF
Hopefully that will help explain the situation I am trying to solve. My original plan was to 45 all the pieces but since I went the route of butting the joints, I have no idea how I could 45 them at this point.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Splinter Puller - 01-12-2018
(01-12-2018, 12:37 AM)greatscott Wrote: Sorry, I did not post a picture as originally intended.
https://flic.kr/p/23otxkF
Hopefully that will help explain the situation I am trying to solve. My original plan was to 45 all the pieces but since I went the route of butting the joints, I have no idea how I could 45 them at this point.
Just cut each end off at 45 degrees and swap each cutoff to the other end. it would be like mitering each individual piece.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Cooler - 01-12-2018
I've always read that the maximum width of a tenon should be 3-1/2". That same 3-1/2" is a safe width for a face grain to end grain joint.
You could make a "pyramid" end cap and tenon and glue it into the "mortise" that has been created at the end.
Something like this, but sized to fit.
![[Image: 096.jpg]](https://xtremeedeals.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/096.jpg)
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - greatscott - 01-12-2018
(01-12-2018, 08:22 AM)Cooler Wrote: I've always read that the maximum width of a tenon should be 3-1/2". That same 3-1/2" is a safe width for a face grain to end grain joint.
You could make a "pyramid" end cap and tenon and glue it into the "mortise" that has been created at the end.
Something like this, but sized to fit.
Thank you for your response. What would be the easiest way to make the mortises if I make them at a 45 degree angle to accept the pyramid tenon? Chisel them out? I think I can make two of the cuts on the table saw (the top and bottom pieces but I'm assuming the other two (front and back pieces) will need to be cut out with a chisel?
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - Cooler - 01-12-2018
The opening at the end of the mantle would serve as the mortise. Cut a piece of hardwood to fit snuggly inside that.
Not much strength is required for this, so you can just use 4 pocket screws to attach the end cap to the tenon.
After that, just slip the tenon into the opening at the end and check for fit. If it fits well, then glue it in place. The tenon only needs to be a couple of inches deep so you could just put a couple of wood screws into the end grain of the tenon and attach it to the cap that way. I would also use glue.
You could treat the opening as a secret hideaway, and not glue the tenon in place. Pull it out to access the hideaway.
RE: How thick of veneer for end "cap"? - rwe2156 - 01-13-2018
I would miter the whole end like SP said.
I think you can do it with a hand saw and fine tune with a hand plane.
You could use 1/4" thick veneer/cap ends with moulding. I don't think the piece is wide enough for movement to be an issue.
Another alternative is to just cap it and leave the edges a bit proud. You could profile the edges.