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+-- Thread: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning (/showthread.php?tid=7354995)
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outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Latech15 - 05-02-2020
I had a neighbor ask me to build a cabinet for his patio. This will live outside forever and he is debating not using a finish at all and letting the Spanish cedar naturally gray. There is obviously more to the cabinet that the drawing, but the part in the drawing is what I am having trouble with. How would you join the bottom shelf, all solid wood, about 16" wide, to the end panels in a way that would allow for wood movement?
I thought about veneering the board, but for always outside use, I don't like that idea. The ends will have drawers and the middle will be a shelf, so it will be visible. No frame and panel because it will be seen in the middle.
This one has me stumped.
![[Image: 8mDLulH.png]](https://i.imgur.com/8mDLulH.png)
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - The Tinman - 05-02-2020
I think I would use pocket hole screws drilled in from underneath. They wouldn't be visible and they would allow a bit of wiggle room, especially if you wallow the holes on the outer screws a bit.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Gary G™ - 05-02-2020
I would just float it in a 3-sided rebate.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Admiral - 05-02-2020
I'm thinking a dado in the side and rear rails, make the rails a full 1" thick and then a 1/2" deep dado, no glue, no fasteners.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Gary G™ - 05-02-2020
I meant dado or groove, not rabbet or rebate.
We’re saying the same thing.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - jteneyck - 05-02-2020
I would capture in a dado, too, but you still need to allow it to expand/contract so it doesn't blow the side panel stiles off. And it looks like it needs to hold the sides in place, too, meaning it can't just float. So, with that in mind, I think I would do one of two things. First, if you make the bottom as a frame and panel you could attach the end rails to the cabinet sides rigidly, by gluing them into the dados. Alternatively, if using a solid bottom, you could set it into the dados with a wedged thru tenon on both sides near the front edge and have all the expansion go into the dado at the back. Either approach should provide rigidty while allowing things to move w/o tearing it apart.
One other idea would be to set the bottom above the bottom side rail and join it to the panels in the sides. Then you could use a thru tenon at both the front and back, or just glue it in if the side panels are thick enough, because all the panels will shrink/expand the same.
John
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Gary G™ - 05-02-2020
Quote:The ends will have drawers and the middle will be a shelf, so it will be visible. No frame and panel because it will be seen in the middle.Re-reading this, it seems you’re not planning on doors across the cabinet such that the weather has full access to the shelf.
Is this correct?
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - KC - 05-02-2020
(05-02-2020, 09:24 AM)Gary G™ Wrote: I would just float it in a 3-sided rebate.
What he said.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - Willyou - 05-02-2020
You might consider installing a front and back rail with M&T joints at the legs (like the end rails). Then simply lay the solid shelf on top of the rails and fasten it with Z clips or blocks with elongated holes. This way the shelf is just a shelf and not part of the structure.
RE: outdoor cabinet - wood movement planning - jteneyck - 05-02-2020
(05-02-2020, 02:06 PM)Willyou Wrote: You might consider installing a front and back rail with M&T joints at the legs (like the end rails). Then simply lay the solid shelf on top of the rails and fasten it with Z clips or blocks with elongated holes. This way the shelf is just a shelf and not part of the structure.
Brilliant !
John