HVAC Condenser pumped 100 gals of water into the attic!?!?

[Mandrake]

My neighbor gets the award for most amazing home system breakdown. The story, as I best understand it, is:

Monday morning at 3:00 AM neighbor heads to the shower. His HVAC is just outside the master bath. The unit calls for cooling and tries to start. He describes hearing ' a really load bad noise' comming from the condenser. So he goes to the Tstat and shuts it down. He leaves it off and heads to work.

At 5:00 AM, the wife calls in a panic because water is gushing through the ceiling in the home. Our homes have a ball valve curb water shut off without stops. So she spins the valve but doesn't get it closed. Neighbor returns home to find the hot water tank leaking. Our tanks are in the attic. It is gushing water from where the copper charge line enters the tank.

He touches the tank and gets a mild shock. He kills the water and finds electrical arcing at the dielectric joint. The arcing has burned the gasket, causing the leak. It has also fubar'd the tank's connect. He kills the breakers to the AC condenser and arcing at the tank stops. Plumber installs a new tank a few hours later.

Insurance, restoration company, and HVAC guys are called out. The HVAC system is 4 years old and the original contractor shows up. At this point, I lose track of all the players, but I know the HVAC guy claims that the condenser's disconnect box is wired wrong, and he re-wires it. Later an electrician is called out, he claims that the re-wired box is wired wrong and he re-wires it (again).

Plumber suspects a short in a wall, or a worn spot on the wires where they leave the building and transition to flex. Here are the photos of the disconnect box:

The box as it was for 4 years, and leading up to Monday morning:


The box after the first re-wire:




The box after the second re-wire



I believe it is at least a 5 ton unit. The way he explained it, I took the box to be the 220V mounted on the outside wall at the condenser, but the photos are obviously in the attic by the evaporator. This wouldn't explain the loud sound from the compressor, would it?

[Robert Adams]

There is so much wrong in all of those pictures.

That looks like 8 ga wire for the feeder. The black and white from it should go to the inside connections of the disconnect.

The wire going to the condenser uses the outer connections.

The grounds both go to the ground bar.


The other wire is a 14ga wire which is way way way way too small to power a condenser. I'm not sure what they are powering with that disconnect. Maybe the air handler.

If it is the air handler then it's 110 so the grounds go to the ground bar then the black wires would go to one side of the disconnect. Then the whites would be wire nutted together.

[daddo]

That's all kinds of wrong if it's 220v, on some even 120v.

What is one leg doing on the ground bar??

Then, what is one leg doing always hot to the unit?

Is this to an air handler or furnace?

Box flat on ceiling and no stress connector, black and white wires - white not marked for 220v.

Are you sure it is 220v?

Why do they put water heaters in attics?????

[blackhat]

OMG. There is no excuse for that.

[Robert Adams]

Pretty common to put water heaters in attics here but usually further south than us. Very common in houses in Memphis as well.

I don't like it myself either. Royal pita to replace waterheaters. Often the old one gets left up in the attic as its a short fat and won't fit back down the attic hatch... Also very common for a foot to make its way through the ceiling during replacement.....

Imo keep the water heater in the garage where it belongs. Easy to change and if it leaks the water runs out the door.

[blackhat]

The water heater belongs in the basement, right next to the furnace and close by the floor drain.

[Robert Adams]

blackhat said:

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The water heater belongs in the basement, right next to the furnace and close by the floor drain.

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Unfortunately only a small percentage of houses in the us have a basement. They are more popular up north but they are still the minority.

I know people up north with basements that move south and say oh I'm only looking for a 2k sqft house... Then when they realize houses don't have basements they are loosing out on 2k sqft of house that up north was free but very costly to get that same overall size here.

I don't know why they are so rare here other than the excavation costs are much higher here.

[Phil Thien]

Robert Adams said:

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If it is the air handler then it's 110 so the grounds go to the ground bar then the black wires would go to one side of the disconnect. Then the whites would be wire nutted together.

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I think you nailed it on the head but the reason the electrician (who got it right, it would seem) compromised a little was that "Pete the butcher" maybe cut the grounds back?

The question is, is there another disconnect somewhere for the condenser? And how is THAT unit wired?

[daddo]

Phil Thien said:

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[blockquote]Robert Adams said:

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If it is the air handler then it's 110 so the grounds go to the ground bar then the black wires would go to one side of the disconnect. Then the whites would be wire nutted together.

---

I think you nailed it on the head but the reason the electrician (who got it right, it would seem) compromised a little was that "Pete the butcher" maybe cut the grounds back?

The question is, is there another disconnect somewhere for the condenser? And how is THAT unit wired?

---

[/blockquote]


I've never seen a 120v air handler.
Perhaps they are made, but that would greatly reduce the available elect heat with one circuit and not practical.

[Robert Adams]

daddo said:

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[blockquote]Phil Thien said:

---

[blockquote]Robert Adams said:

---

If it is the air handler then it's 110 so the grounds go to the ground bar then the black wires would go to one side of the disconnect. Then the whites would be wire nutted together.

---

I think you nailed it on the head but the reason the electrician (who got it right, it would seem) compromised a little was that "Pete the butcher" maybe cut the grounds back?

The question is, is there another disconnect somewhere for the condenser? And how is THAT unit wired?

---

[/blockquote]


I've never seen a 120v air handler.
Perhaps they are made, but that would greatly reduce the available elect heat with one circuit and not practical.

---

[/blockquote]

Gas furnace most likely. I wish they were 220 as well. Course I wish most everything was 220 or better yet get 3 phase to houses one of these days.

Just not 220 on one leg like the uk. 110 per leg is much safer. They even have work site transformers that input 220 one leg and output 110 two leg so they can still run their 220 stuff but you will only get zapped by 110 if something happens. Course their house breaker panels are scary cheaply made but they work for them.