LN Tenon Saw Handle

[agerlach]

Several months ago I bought a LN dovetail saw off of woodnet and I love it. The handle feels like it was custom made for my hand. Perfect width and girth and I really like the longer lower horn. I have had good sawing success using the lower horn to support the saw weight like described by C. Schwarz here. 

So, when I needed a tenon saw I decided to bite the bullet on a new LN Tenon b/c of how much I liked the dovetail handle. I know the tenon handles were closed but when the tenon saw came I was disappoint to find out that handle is much wider and has less girth. I could probably get over those differences but I also found, to my surprise, that the lower horn is much shorter. Combining the shorter lower horn with the much heavier saw, I find it very difficult to hold the saw with a "relaxed" grip like I have been used to with the LN dovetail or even some of the vintage Disston panel saws I have. 

I would think that the heavier the saw, the more advantageous a large lower horn would be. Am I missing something or is there a different technique I should be using? I have no idea how old the dovetail saw I bought is. Has some of the handle geometry changed over time? Or am I wrong in my assumption that the "fit" of all the LN saws would be similar. 

I will admit that I haven't cut with the saw yet just in case I decide to return it.

[AHill]

I'd never heard of Schwarz's theory of using the lower horn to support the weight of the saw when establishing a kerf. I think his point is it's easier to establish a kerf when you aren't applying too much downward pressure at the beginning of the cut. It's another way of saying let the saw do the work. Schwarz has a habit of speculating on how things were done by establishing his own theory on certain things. It's sort of his trademark. To my knowledge, it's not in any woodworking instructional books that I'm aware of. But I don't have an extensive historical library of hand tool books, either.

LN's lower horn on their tenon saws does appear to be shorter than other brands, e.g.. Bad Axe, The Veritas tenon saws have an even shorter lower horn than Lie-Nielsen. The fact that heavier saws don't necessarily have longer lower horns than dovetail saws is likely an indicator that the lower horn was never intentionally designed to support the saw weight when establishing a kerf. Personally, I think the horns exist only to keep your hand in the same position on the handle when sawing. It's less of an issue with a close-handled saw because of the nature of a closed handle.

[agerlach]

I agree that the point is to "let the saw do the work". Your reply got me thinking about the weight vs lower horn length. I think one of the reasons that it felt so unstable to me was because I was just holding it in the air. I decided I need to see what if felt like when some of the weight was support by the piece being cut. This made a huge difference. I had no problem starting the kerf and it felt great in my hand. Thanks.

[Derek Cohen]

Interestingly for me, I came to the opposite theory with regard to the horns. That is, the upper horn allows one to rest the handle/saw in the hand when the weight comes off it (as you loosen your grip, the saw/handle will want to drop in your hand). I designed handles that effectively pushed the grip upwards (similar to handles on woodies - thicker at the base than at the top) ...





These are very comfortable and balanced saws.

Like may users, there are likely to be variations preferred by all.

Regards from Perth

Derek