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No, but this looks very interesting. I noted they have several bases, and even a clear version. Thanks for posting it.
John
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12-27-2016, 02:58 PM
(This post was last modified: 12-27-2016, 03:00 PM by Cooler.)
The main down side that I've read is that you have to strain this stuff each time you use it and you have to use a fresh plastic roller tray liner each time and you have to strain it again if it is open for more than 30 minutes. All of the above are a product of the fast drying nature. Cutting back with 10% water is supposed to hasten drying and is using a HVLP unit that generates warm air.
But for spraying is sounds very interesting. Fast dry, good adhesion and a very hard surface.
Benjamin Moore has a similar product but it is supposed to take 6 + hours to dry and 2 weeks to a month to reach full hardness. I am not that patient.
Sherwin-Williams has their Pro Classic, but the PPG stuff sounds like it drys faster and harder. Both vendors are convenient to me.
Also they only offer glossy and satin; no semi-gloss. I wonder if you can mix the gloss with the satin to achieve semi-gloss. I guess if you could they would offer that option.
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I'm pretty sure you could mix the satin with the gloss to get SG.
I assume the BM product you referred to is Advance? If so, that stuff takes more like 12+ hours before you can scuff sand it to recoat, and more like 2 months or longer to fully cure. Great stuff, though. As is SW's ProClassic. Both those products are probably easier to use for hand application if you really have to clean/strain, etc. that frequently with the PPG product. For spraying, however, the PPG product sounds like it has some very nice attributes. I like that it comes in a range of bases which must mean that it can be had in a wide color range, unlike ProClassic. One of the things I really like about Advance is it comes in BM's full color range.
John
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12-27-2016, 04:12 PM
(This post was last modified: 12-27-2016, 04:13 PM by Cooler.)
I will go to the PPG store this weekend and talk to them. Maybe buy a small sample to test.
The 15 minute dry to touch time is great but I imagine that the open can will skin over pretty fast as will the roller. Maybe a retarder can be used to slow it down for brushing. I'll ask.
At least is will not smell like oil paints (which seems still to have a durability edge in the cabinet finishes.
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I would look at this stuff as spray only. Sounds like a real pain to try to use with a roller. Even a brush might be challenging. Spraying, though, sounds like a winner.
John
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I know automotive paints and other paints are different. The types of clear-coats I use in my type of automotive repair work are all fast drying. Some of my clear coats are "dry to touch" in just a couple minutes. That doesn't mean they are ready to handle. It just means that they aren't tacky and dust won't stick to it. It may be another half hour under heat before I can actually handle it. Also, fast drying and curing products tend to have very short working times and they don't have a chance to "flow-out" before they start setting up so they can be grainy or suffer from orange peel. To counter that I have to lay it on fast and heavy. It takes some getting used to.
It will be interesting to see how well this flows out and how good the final product looks.
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(12-28-2016, 07:36 AM)Snipe Hunter Wrote: I know automotive paints and other paints are different. The types of clear-coats I use in my type of automotive repair work are all fast drying.
In 2000 I bought a new Toyota (Scion). It was the first year that they were using the new water-borne finishes.
When the car was new I could easily scratch the finish with my thumbnail. It did not fully harden for a full year. The newer finishes are much better. New laws force manufacturers to introduce not-quite-ready-for-prime-time products. The low VOC finishes were one of those products.
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The laws aren't really new. Neither is the paint. The manufacturers have been using waterborne paints since the 90s. I've been using low VOC paints for about three years. Maryland was on of the first states to make it mandatory. Many shops and manufacturers used it voluntarily because it looks good and they got a jump on the technology. I use what's called a hybrid low VOC paint. It's a solvent based paint without the solvent. Instead of solvent, a cocktail of low VOC solvents and other liquids are added to the pigment to drop the VOC to legal levels. It's a pain to mix and it's pricey (about $20.00 an ounce- pre mixed) but it dries fast, the colors match well and it looks great.
I had problems with the water based (ppg) pigments. They would get a dry skim on top which wouldn't break down when mixed so it would have spots in it. It would break apart but not thin out. It became unusable after about 5 months in the bottle. 5 months in a can isn't very long.
The biggest issue with the low VOC products is the cost. It's easily double the cost of traditional solvent based paints. The clear-coats are even higher. You can't put water in clear coat so they use other low VOC chemicals. A decent low VOC clear runs around $400 a gallon without the hardener or reducer. You don't want to spill it.
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I Have Been Use PPG breakthrough for over 3 years now, and Right it is not easy to brush or roll. what we do is mask up kitchens and spray inside and out of the casing , as well as doors and drawers. and even though it says dry in 15 mins this is true ! but it does not cures that fast. i have tried heat and cool air to dry it up and to cure it faster.i have found if i put it in my basement to dry it dry and cures in a day with the AC Running. i thinking the dehumidifier is making it dry and cure faster. and i have also found adding 1 to 2 ounces of bottle water to a gal makes it so slick like a lacquer and my clients love it. i never take a chance with only paint bonding. i ALWAYS Prime with Kilz (oil base) primers. just for all the smoke,grease,and water , that is in the kitchen. now i know for a fact that Breakthrough from ppg will stick. and with kilz you can sand it slick as a car finish and just use the breakthrough as a light thin coat.
I do 5 to 7 sets of cabinets per month using breakthrough it is great product but it is still a paint and paint needs to cure
Here is some info on the product
Eagle Painting
