grizzly 0453 gearbox

[woodydixon]

This started out as simply trying to spin my infeed roller to adjust it. I never could get it out of gear to easily find bdc. A few days ago i talked to grizzly technical support and told them what i was trying to do but could not get the speed control into neutral so the roller could be spun by hand. I was told my problem was a loose bolt on top of the shifting fudge . Today I have completely disassembled the gearbox and that bolt is tight. The gears look ok to me but if I am on the high speed gear it will shift to neutral but will not shift and engage the low speed gear unless i move that gear by hand so the shifting gear meshes. 

I am not entirely clear on how this works since there is no clutch. The manual says this should be done while the planer is running to avoid damage. How exactly does this work? It seems the low and high speed gear are not lining up when stopped and when running , since they are turning at different speeds would not line up then anyway. Ii seems this method would damage the gears unless you got lucky they meshed when you first pushed the rod to engage the gear. 

This also does not explain why I couldn't get the gearbox in neutral before. I seem to have no trouble doing that with the gearbox apart. Any help would be appreciated as I am not a mechanic and don't seem to be making much progress on this problem.

[lift mechanic]

I can't really answer your question, but I have a Delta DC380 and change gears only while running with no grinding of gears. I would suspect yours is the same. Have you tried to get in neutral , in between gears, while running? Then shut it off, and unplug it, and do the adjustments.

[woodydixon]

I can't really answer your question, but I have a Delta DC380 and change gears only while running with no grinding of gears. I would suspect yours is the same. Have you tried to get in neutral , in between gears, while running? Then shut it off, and unplug it, and do the adjustments.

I did and it didn't seem to work. The infeed roller was still locked. One thing I don't understand is how the gears are supposed to mesh running at regular speed without some grinding. I also dont understand why it got in neutral manually fine with the gearbox apart but wouldn't assembled. Thanks.

[oakey]

Woody
I had my 453 year box apart twice both times because the gears failed it is made to be shifted running but NOT while using it (not under any load) the gears are slightly bevelled
See the parts diagram gear 523 slides on the shaft between the double gear 526 (cluster gear ) it will have some gear clash just the nature of this design
Really does not hurt anything unless your shifting it a few hundred times a week just shift it like you mean it not super slow as then it does have an opertunity to grind more
Try moving gear 523 back and fourth on its shaft it's what moves in the gear box when you change speeds and it's held in place with the detent ball and spring 519 and 520 just so it don't shift itself
Very possible for the detent to be damaged you should be able to feel that it is in high neutral and low as you slide the gear
When you reassemble the gear box best replace the oil seal these commonly leak a bit at the seal and gasket
Mine failed the 526 gear twice when it was almost new 20 hours or so first time second time slightly longer evidently both times the part had missed a factory heat treat operation
Second time it failed I changed the high speed to 20 FPM from 30 feet per minute using 454 gears 9 years later still going strong never any more trouble

[woodydixon]

Woody
I had my 453 year box apart twice both times because the gears failed it is made to be shifted running but NOT while using it (not under any load)  the gears are slightly  bevelled
See the parts diagram gear 523 slides on the shaft between the double gear 526 (cluster gear ) it will have some gear clash just the nature of this design
Really does not hurt anything unless your shifting it a few hundred times a week      just shift it like you mean it not super slow as then it does have an opertunity to grind more
Try moving gear 523 back and fourth on its shaft it's what moves in the gear box when you change speeds and it's held in place with the detent ball and spring 519 and 520 just so it don't shift itself
Very possible for the detent to be damaged you should be able to feel that it is in high neutral and low as you slide the gear
When you reassemble the gear box best replace the oil seal these commonly leak a bit at the seal and gasket
Mine failed the 526 gear twice when it was almost new 20 hours or so first time second time slightly longer evidently both times the part had missed a factory heat treat  operation
Second time it failed I changed the high speed to 20 FPM from 30 feet per minute  using 454 gears 9 years later still going strong never any more trouble

[woodydixon]

Oakey<

Thanks for responding. The 524 gear moves easily when i push and pull on the speed handle shaft. I assume that means the detente is ok. What it will not do is mesh with the low gear on 527 without manually turning that gear to line it up. It looks like it is not damaged. Also, I really cant tell if it is in low, high or neutral without looking at the gears.  Does all this mean that the 527 gear is damaged but I just can't see it? Also , since I didn't remove the back of the gearbox from the cutterhead do you still think I should replace the oil seal which I assume would involve taking the back of the gearbox off the cutterhead?

[Arlin Eastman]

I have the 0453z and I have only needed to shift it once.  I wanted it to go faster so while it was turned on I do not remember if it is pulled out or pushed in but it was seamlessly flowing from slow to faster and when I was done I did it back.  I do not need to go faster since I think the cut is better so I leave it.

Do you still have the instructions for the machine?  If not you can get them from Grizzly

[woodydixon]

Oakey,

I taken some pictures showing the problem. One thing I noticed is the 2 gears on the handle shaft part no 524 are not coplanar. Could this be causing the problem meshing with low gear? If so, do I just replace that part and it should then work? I tried to attach the pictures but it wouldn't work, error message file too big. How do I get around that? Thanks.

[Phil Thien]

This reminds me of my old Makita cordless drill with two speeds, which you had to run in order to change the speed gearing from hi-lo or vice versa.

I always figured they had some sort of synchro built into the gearing.  Easy to do when you're shifting under no-load.

[oakey]

Woody
If you did not disturb the seal then no you need not replace it
Because there is no way to really see in that gear case when it is totally assembled it may be hard to determine what is wrong
but first thing I would do is make absolutely sure nothing is bent and that the bearings all are good and that they fit snug in there respective bores
I have a complete set of extra gears and I dug them out and looked at them there is very little relive cut on them for shifting purpose but there is some
look Carful for burs On the teeth you should be able to mesh them easily buy hand with it apart the gear case is quit straight forward you just slid the twin gear that has the slot for the shift fudge gear between two drive gears
Make sure that shift fudge shaft is not bent as that may cause your problem
With the gear case apart not running you will have to turn the shaft to shift because the gears have to be turning to line up make cerntain the drive rollers spin freely (not partly seized) because they have to be free if not you WILL have shifting issues
I assume that what you are saying that the gears are not coplanner is the fact that it is apart and the shafts are only supported at one end ?
If that gear case is like the one in my planer it is not an example of a good machining so every thing can shift around a lot when it is apart
It is not a shift fudge but that is the word the forum uses for F O R K