CNC, Talk me out of it or not

[Gary™]

I'm probably going to buy a Shapeoko 3 XL CNC machine made by Carbide3d in the next week or so.  The next candidate I thought of buying was the Piranha XL by NextWave.   I'm trying to keep the purchase below 3K total budget.   I looked for others but didn't take a close look at the Chinese machines.

Here are the pro's and cons.

SO3 is an open machine and can be modified.  I was a little concerned about it using belts particularly on the Z-axis but found that someone has come up with a Ball-Screw Z-AXIS version that's available for reasonable money if I have issues.   It's cheaper and Carbide3d has better support than NextWave (by far) but it is a partial kit.   It has limit switches that are missing on the Piranha.   I wish they had an entire ball-screw version and I'd already have bought it.  I'm factoring buying Vectric Vcarve Desktop into the purchase so the software would be equivalent.  

The Piranha is not a kit and comes assembled (love that).  It's a closed system and you can't do much to it yourself (kind of a turn-off).   I like that I don't need a PC in the shop and run it from a USB stick (really nice feature) that I wish the SO3 had.   The Piranha has a free laser rebate going on now that would be extra on the SO3.

There are reports of flexing in each unit but this seems likely in this class machine

So I'm open for intelligent opinions

[Carl Grover]

Well, I'm tapping out with the "intelligent opinions" comment.


carl

[Phil Thien]

I'm a Shapeoko 3 owner.

I also have a K2 CNC router.

I wouldn't touch that Piranha XL by NextWave.

[Gary™]

I'm a Shapeoko 3 owner.

I wouldn't touch that Piranha XL by NextWave.

Two questions:

1. What do you wish you know about the Shapeoko 3 before you bought it? (The bad and the unexpected)

2. Why would you stay away from the Piranha?

[Phil Thien]

Two questions:

1. What do you wish you know about the Shapeoko 3 before you bought it?  (The bad and the unexpected)

2. Why would you stay away from the Piranha?

I was an experienced home-CNC router user when I purchased the Shapeoko 3, and I purchased the Shapeoko used.  So I went in with my eyes fairly wide-open.

The biggest difference between the Shapeoko and most CNC routers out there, that a newbie should understand, is that the Shapeoko is entirely belt-driven.  Whereas other units use ACME/ball screws and nuts, the Shapeoko uses belts and gears.

Belt downsides:  Perhaps less precise that high-end screws, less durable too.  Also causes Z-axis to "relax" once power is removed from stepper.
Belt upsides:  Don't require any special efforts for backlash control, cost to precision ratio is outstanding.  Overall precision exceeded by ACME-driven K2 unit.

Screw downsides:  Require some effort to control backlash.
Screw upsides:  Can be very high precision, provided the screws/nuts are high quality (though this comes at a cost).

A second large difference between the Shapeoko (and its like) is the fact that the Shapeoko uses an Arduino-based driver that is controlled over a USB port.  A lot of other designs out there are driven via something lake Mach software driving a parallel port or a smooth stepper.  Or some other proprietary controller like on the Piranha you mention.

I'd stay away from the Piranha because it seems small, and because the units I've seen made of plastic aren't nearly rigid enough.  In fact, the Shapeoko 3 is miles ahead of most similar (to the Piranha) units in terms of rigidity, but where all these less expensive machines suffer is the rigidity of the Z-axis.  The Shapeoko 3 is certainly better than my K2 was, but still lots of room for improvement.

[Brian in sunny FL]

Axiom has a new $3K model I saw at IWF, comes with a 1HP spindle and doesn't use a router motor.  Maybe worth a look the I2R series.

https://www.axiomprecision.com

[Phil B]

Is a cnc routerparts kit in the budget?  Much stiffer frame it looks like than these others.

Phil
http://www.benchmark.20m.com/

[Gary™]

Is a cnc routerparts kit in the budget?  Much stiffer frame it looks like than these others.

Phil
http://www.benchmark.20m.com/

That would be $1000 more than the Shapeoko and blow the budget with you throw in all the extras.

[Stwood_]

Buy one if that's what you want. Whatever floats yer boat Gary.

[opticsguy]

I have been using an X-carve . . .

OK, OK, OK.  Now I will probably receive a thousand reasons why this is a very bad choice. 

However after study the software, I was up and running in about an hour, have made awesome signs and other 2D objects that I have given away and have only received high praise and compliments. I am receiving requests for businesses for signage but I am not in business.  The accuracy has been high (high enough for me) and the ease of use is awesome!!!    The software is SUPER EASY!!!  Even I can do it!!

I would greatly enjoy to "upgrade" but I am NOT a computer programmer and my interests are making cool stuff, not programming computers.  

The X-carve I am using is the 1000mmx1000 mm size, big enough for most projects and you can set it up to make signs as long as you have a board to carve on.  

The downside to an X-carve is you have to assemble it yourself.  It is also a very lightweight machine and probably not durable enough for production work of any kind. 

The costs of the X-carve makes it is easy to get started in CNC. 

When someone comes out with a pro-level machine with software as easy to use as X-carve, I would make the step in that direction.