dust collection with vacuum

[mr_skittle]

I recently added a drum sander to my shop and I'm really excited about the efficiencies it's going to bring to my work. However, I quickly realized that my shop vac wasn't up to the task as it clogged up quickly with the fine dust. The simple fact of the matter is that I DO NOT have room for a large, impeller driven dust collection system, and some sort of shop vac setup is what I'm left with. I know there are a number of options out there such as the Dust Deputy and other similar units that mount on a bucket or drum. Rocker has their big blue separator as well. Even Home Depot has one called the Dustopper that goes on a bucket. From what I can tell they all operate as advertised on the same principle of creating a cyclone of dust/chips and the large ones end up at the bottom. However, I understand they are not all created equal when it comes to the finer dust that a drum sander makes. Because the Dustopper from HD has an attractive price point, I was reading some reviews and they generally agreed it wasn't very good at collecting the fine dust. Is this a trend with all of the cyclone-type systems? What have other folks done for dust collection at the drum sander?

[fredhargis]

I don't believe you will be happy with anything you add to a shop vac to collect dust from a drum sander. They generate mountains (literally) of dust, but even worse...it's all the very smallest particles. Capturing them needs a good volume of air flow, and then to contain them you need the tight filtration. Drum sanders should be sold with a warning about all this, as far as I'm concerned. Back to your question, the only part I can address is what I've done, and that took a fairly large DC which eventually was upgraded to a cyclone. Actually I 'm now on my second commercial cyclone (my third ctyclone, but my first one was shop built) because my first commercial one just didn't separate the finest dust as well as I wanted. I think the current one does, but my DS use has dwindled over the years so I've not checked how well it works. Of course, all this is juts my personal opinion.

[jteneyck]

IMO Fred has it right.  You will not find a shop vac with enough CFM to do the job properly.  If you add a Dust Deputy, etc. in front of it its actual CFM will be even less.  You need a real dust collector, simple as that, with at least 400 or 500 CFM at the machine.  I eliminated the clogging filter problem by tearing apart my 1200 CFM DC system, mounting the fan directly on top of a cyclone, and ducting the exhaust out a nearby window.  The cyclone captures 99% of what comes into, and passes the really fine stuff, the stuff that plugs up filters, out the window where it lands in my bushes and not in my lungs.  

For $300 you could get Rockler's 650 CFM Dust Right Wall Mount DC, remove the bag filter, and duct it out a window.  That would blow all the dust out the window but it might not be a big deal unless you run the drum sander for hours.  A big step up would be to take that unit and mount it on top of a cyclone, still ducted out the window.  Now you'd have a true dust collection system w/o filters to plug up and in a small footprint.   If ducting out the window is a non starter then you're looking at a DC with filters that will need to be replaced regularly.  This one by Onieda would fit the bill, for a price.   

John

[packerguy®]

This one by Onieda would fit the bill, for a price.   

John

While that is a fantastic collector for a drum sander application due to the high pressure, its certainly not an entry level machine and for the price tag he could get a conventional cyclone for not much more, which he doent need. 

I own an onieda collector and had the discussions with their sales about the super cell when it came out.

[KC]

IMO Fred has it right.  You will not find a shop vac with enough CFM to do the job properly.  If you add a Dust Deputy, etc. in front of it its actual CFM will be even less.  You need a real dust collector, simple as that, with at least 400 or 500 CFM at the machine.  I eliminated the clogging filter problem by tearing apart my 1200 CFM DC system, mounting the fan directly on top of a cyclone, and ducting the exhaust out a nearby window.  The cyclone captures 99% of what comes into, and passes the really fine stuff, the stuff that plugs up filters, out the window where it lands in my bushes and not in my lungs.  

For $300 you could get Rockler's 650 CFM Dust Right Wall Mount DC, remove the bag filter, and duct it out a window.  That would blow all the dust out the window but it might not be a big deal unless you run the drum sander for hours.  A big step up would be to take that unit and mount it on top of a cyclone, still ducted out the window.  Now you'd have a true dust collection system w/o filters to plug up and in a small footprint.   If ducting out the window is a non starter then you're looking at a DC with filters that will need to be replaced regularly.  This one by Onieda would fit the bill, for a price.   

John

Disclaimer:  I've never been one of those guys tryong to capture 99.67% of dust in the shop, but 'properly' is an important word here.  I've been using a Ridgid vac with my Performax 16/32 for a couple years now.  2-1/2 hose to the machine (from back when I had a proper dust collector), and then I don't even have a 'connection' from the vac to that hose.  I just shove the shop vac up the other end as far as it will go.   What it doesn't collect drops off the belt under the in/out feed tables... but I expect 90% goes to the vac.

[jteneyck]

Disclaimer:  I've never been one of those guys tryong to capture 99.67% of dust in the shop, but 'properly' is an important word here.  I've been using a Ridgid vac with my Performax 16/32 for a couple years now.  2-1/2 hose to the machine (from back when I had a proper dust collector), and then I don't even have a 'connection' from the vac to that hose.  I just shove the shop vac up the other end as far as it will go.   What it doesn't collect drops off the belt under the in/out feed tables... but I expect 90% goes to the vac.

If that works for you then good deal but the OP already stated that his shop vac doesn't work on his drum sander.  

John

[packerguy®]

You need a dust collector. Not only is your problem the vac getting "clogged" with dust, but the whole idea with a minimum of 600 cfm "at the drum sander" is that it has an insane amount of heat generated because of the friction of how sandpaper works. Add excess dust into that equation and you will start to burn the wood and wear out the papers really really fast.

At minimum, get a 1-1/2 hp unit like the one harbor freight sells for example if budget is a concern. Or get a used Jet one with the filter canister, and DONT pipe it. Just set it up directly next to the sander and use a short run of flex hose.

[mr_skittle]

Well folks, I don't like what I'm hearing! My little 1.5 car garage just doesn't have room for a standard dust collector. The sander itself already cut into my very limited staging and assembly area. I suppose the Rockler wall-mount one could work but it's not really ideal. I could find a used, full-size one for the same price. But considering my dilemma, that's a moot point. I do have a small "attic" area in the rafters that could possibly be the home of a dust collector but that would be a tricky proposition.

The biggest issue is one that packerguy brought up about the heat buildup. I could live with using a shop vac, opening the door, and running a fan but that doesn't address the heat, or the dust buildup on the paper either, just the airborne dust.

Working in a small shop is really a bummer when it comes to growing my hobby or building a business...

[mr_skittle]

Call it a coincidence or call it fate, but a 1.5 HP Jet dust collector showed up for sale on CL between my original post and my reply. And the kicker, only $150! I feel like I have to go for it and figure out the details later. The darn drum sander showed up for sale with the same sort of fate. I'm fretting over how I can make a go of it as an independent woodworker when I have to spend so much time sanding by hand on the item I'm hoping to sell. The next day an old Ryobi sander showed up for pennies on the dollar. How could I say no?

[fredhargis]

That's a good buy on the Jet DC, but remember some of the older ones (maybe the new ones as well) came with 30 micron bags. If that's the case it will amount to little more than a dust pump, unless you vent it outside (or sit it outside completely and pipe it into the garage). You can easily (but it's costs) get higher effeciancy bags, or even better a filter, and refit the DC. If it has 1 micron bags you will see a huge improvement in dust collection and containment.