Logs to Lumber

[Tapper]

I must have Sapele on the brain.  The deck is Ipe', and still a PITA to clean and maintain.  Looks great when done, but not worth the effort to keep it looking that way.  If there ever is a next time it will be composite.  Clearly, you already figured that out.  


Handrails are almost never truly square or rectangular, but they will be if you run them through your planer.  And then you'll still have to deal with the corners unless you plane so much off as to eliminate whatever radii they have.  I would strip and sand them to clean wood.  If you want to use a clear finish I would start with epoxy sealer and then Epifanes Marine varnish.  Don't waste money on Helmsman Spar Varnish or similar products if the railing will see direct sunshine and rain/snow.  But let me warn you Epifanes requires 7 coats, the first 4 thinned various amounts, so it's not a light undertaking.  

Paint will last longer and be easier to maintain.  And clear of transparent waterproofer like CWF is about the easiest to apply and maintain.  

How's that stair project coming along?  

John

Handrails are in direct sunlight and of course in the rain and snow in the winter time. Don't know that I want to do 7 coats of anything. What's wrong with marine spar varnish? Seems like it's been used on boats forever, which are subject to harsh environments regularly.

Stair project is still on hold. I know you don't want to hear this, but your work on Sketchup is still the plan. I just have to get it back in the queue. FWIW I think you're in your element with this new mill. With the new wood shed and the setup you have with those arborists it seems like an ideal situation. Keep us up to date!

Doug

[jteneyck]

Handrails are in direct sunlight and of course in the rain and snow in the winter time. Don't know that I want to do 7 coats of anything. What's wrong with marine spar varnish? Seems like it's been used on boats forever, which are subject to harsh environments regularly.

Stair project is still on hold. I know you don't want to hear this, but your work on Sketchup is still the plan. I just have to get it back in the queue. FWIW I think you're in your element with this new mill. With the new wood shed and the setup you have with those arborists it seems like an ideal situation. Keep us up to date!

Doug

Well, those beautiful boats generally stay in a boat shed when not being used.  The ones that sit at a dock all season almost always have someone working on them.  Every year someone is scraping and sanding and adding a new coat or two of varnish.  A number of years ago FWW did some weathering tests on several exterior varnishes.  Helmsman Spar varnish didn't survive a single year.  Epifanes Marine varnish tested the best as a single component system and Epifanes over epoxy primer was the best.  


If you don't want to apply 7 coats to start with, and I don't blame you, it's not fun, then you might consider SW's A100 deep base #4 (I think), with no added pigments.  It looks white in the can, but dries clear and many report several years before having to do maintenance.  I haven't used it, so this is just based on what others here have posted.  

Another option I have used is Target Coatings EM-9300.  It can be sprayed or brushed on and it's beautiful and hard, and being waterbased it dries very quickly.  3 or 4 coats.  Sound better?  

John

[Tapper]

Well, those beautiful boats generally stay in a boat shed when not being used.  The ones that sit at a dock all season almost always have someone working on them.  Every year someone is scraping and sanding and adding a new coat or two of varnish.  A number of years ago FWW did some weathering tests on several exterior varnishes.  Helmsman Spar varnish didn't survive a single year.  Epifanes Marine varnish tested the best as a single component system and Epifanes over epoxy primer was the best.  


If you don't want to apply 7 coats to start with, and I don't blame you, it's not fun, then you might consider SW's A100 deep base #4 (I think), with no added pigments.  It looks white in the can, but dries clear and many report several years before having to do maintenance.  I haven't used it, so this is just based on what others here have posted.  

Another option I have used is Target Coatings EM-9300.  It can be sprayed or brushed on and it's beautiful and hard, and being waterbased it dries very quickly.  3 or 4 coats.  Sound better?  

John

The EMTECH EM9300 looks promising. I like the fact that it's water based (easy cleanup). Where can it be bought locally? I also looked at this Minwax product that got high marks in an independent comparison test (oil based). Lowe's has it in satin and Walmart in semi-gloss. I'm not under the illusion that any finish will last longer than 2-3 years before it needs to be at least touched up. These handrails are basically long 2x6's laid flat and installed with wood screws on two 1x rails that support the pickets (hope this makes sense). Pretty easy to remove the screws, haul them into the shop, sand, refinish and re-install.

The other choice I suppose is to use a couple of long pieces of Choice Deck. Very durable, no maintenance but not the natural wood look. This front entryway has a landing that is covered by a timberframe structure with 12/12 pitches on the roof. After the timber framer installed it, I put up T&G wood planks on the underside of the ceiling, varnished. Point is everything looks "woodsy" and I'd like to keep it that way.

Doug

[jteneyck]

The EMTECH EM9300 looks promising. I like the fact that it's water based (easy cleanup). Where can it be bought locally? I also looked at this Minwax product that got high marks in an independent comparison test (oil based). Lowe's has it in satin and Walmart in semi-gloss. I'm not under the illusion that any finish will last longer than 2-3 years before it needs to be at least touched up. These handrails are basically long 2x6's laid flat and installed with wood screws on two 1x rails that support the pickets (hope this makes sense). Pretty easy to remove the screws, haul them into the shop, sand, refinish and re-install.

The other choice I suppose is to use a couple of long pieces of Choice Deck. Very durable, no maintenance but not the natural wood look. This front entryway has a landing that is covered by a timberframe structure with 12/12 pitches on the roof. After the timber framer installed it, I put up T&G wood planks on the underside of the ceiling, varnished. Point is everything looks "woodsy" and I'd like to keep it that way.

Doug

AFAIK, Target Coatings' products are available only through the internet.  I did see something from them recently where they now have a distributor in Denver or someplace W. of the Mississippi, so you might look into that to save shipping costs.  I've had no trouble ordering from them on-line.  

The Minwax link you posted takes me to Helsman Spar Varnish.  Whatever product you choose needs to have a lot of UV absorbers in it to protect the resin from breaking down.  Your application is pretty severe since the handrail is laying flat side up with a lot of direct exposure to sun, rain, snow, etc.  I think you are right to anticipate having to do maintenance at least every two years no matter what you use, but that's only for the top end products; lesser ones won't last a year.  

I just thought of another product you should consider, Cetol Door and Window It's OB but goes on great with a bristle brush.  You must use at least two coats of one of the pigmented versions, but can topcoat that with more of the pigmented one or use their clear topcoat.  I used two coats of the mahogany and one coat of satin clear on this Sapele door that I made 3 years ago.  



It faces directly W and gets beat on by the afternoon sun, and also gets direct rain exposure.  It's not as brutal a test as your handrails, but so far the finish is perfect.  The nice part about this product is that it breathes, so the finish won't blister, and it wears down over time so it doesn't build up when you need to recoat it.  I know the owner and get to see the door every few months.  So far, the finish has exceeded my expectations.  

John

[®smpr_fi_mac®]

I'm only responding to say that I'm jealous and kinda hate you a little bit. It's not personal.

[TGW]

We sawed some 50 logs in the forenoon today.
A bit late on the season but I have been ill and unable to do such work until now.
Now I need to sticker it all before it catches some fungus.

[Tapper]

AFAIK, Target Coatings' products are available only through the internet.  I did see something from them recently where they now have a distributor in Denver or someplace W. of the Mississippi, so you might look into that to save shipping costs.  I've had no trouble ordering from them on-line.  

The Minwax link you posted takes me to Helsman Spar Varnish.  Whatever product you choose needs to have a lot of UV absorbers in it to protect the resin from breaking down.  Your application is pretty severe since the handrail is laying flat side up with a lot of direct exposure to sun, rain, snow, etc.  I think you are right to anticipate having to do maintenance at least every two years no matter what you use, but that's only for the top end products; lesser ones won't last a year.  

I just thought of another product you should consider, Cetol Door and Window It's OB but goes on great with a bristle brush.  You must use at least two coats of one of the pigmented versions, but can topcoat that with more of the pigmented one or use their clear topcoat.  I used two coats of the mahogany and one coat of satin clear on this Sapele door that I made 3 years ago.  



It faces directly W and gets beat on by the afternoon sun, and also gets direct rain exposure.  It's not as brutal a test as your handrails, but so far the finish is perfect.  The nice part about this product is that it breathes, so the finish won't blister, and it wears down over time so it doesn't build up when you need to recoat it.  I know the owner and get to see the door every few months.  So far, the finish has exceeded my expectations.  

John

Yes, it says on the can "Minwax" along with Helsman Spar Urathane; gets pretty good reviews and is oil based. The Cetol you mentioned looks like it's a stain. I don't really need to stain the wood, just coat it.

Doug

[jteneyck]

I'm only responding to say that I'm jealous and kinda hate you a little bit.  It's not personal.

No worries.  I felt the same way until I finally decided the fun I would have milling lumber with a bandsaw mill outweighed the lack of obvious economic justification.  And remember, they are happy to sell you one, too.  

John

[jteneyck]

We sawed some 50 logs in the forenoon today.
A bit late on the season but I have been ill and unable to do such work until now.
Now I need to sticker it all before it catches some fungus.

Holy cow, that must be a fully automated mill.  Got any photos?  


I suspect 10 logs in a day will be a big day with my mill, though I have no intention of seeing if it's even capable of that unless someone is paying me really well.  My arborist friend dropped this load of ash logs off yesterday.  He's clearing a lot for a new house build, but all were already dead or dying from the Emerald ash borer so they would have had to have come down anyway or fallen on their own.



The one on the right was of no interest with the crook and limbs, so I sawed it into firewood lengths for splitting.  The others all look pretty good, 8.5 to just over 10' long and around 20"+ at the butt end.  I also have two 4' walnut logs and another 8' long one that I dug 4 nails and a drywall screw out of to mill.  I think I'll do that one last - just in case.  So that's the equivalent of 7 full length logs to mill and sticker.  He's bringing some maple logs in a couple of weeks so I'll be busy.  Better get started on that solar drier soon.  As it now stands, I'm laying a couple more drying racks in shady spots out back to sticker the lumber on until the drier is done.  

I really like the look of rift and QS ash and I'm going to try to mill at least one of these logs to yield the most lumber with those grain orientations.  Woodmizer has a chart on how to go about it.  It's not as involved as true quarter sawing, but it's still harder than just cutting a square cant and sawing through.  Walnut, on the other hand, looks very pedestrian to me when QS; I much prefer face grain, so those logs will be cut to maximize that orientation.  I'll take some photos to show you what I'm talking about when I mill them.  

To make rolling logs on the mill easier I modified an extra cant hook so I can attach it to the end of the winch cable.  I saw this idea on a Norwood video and thought it should be a nearly stress free way to roll logs/cants.  Can't wait to give it a try.  

John

[Stwood_]

I used my truck to pull/roll the logs up on my mill when I had no tractor to load them with. It had a winch setup, but I quickly got away from that.
When I pulled them up, I used the same winch cable, and also had a cant hook end on the cable.
Tapped it in to insure it stayed in the log. You don't want it coming loosing and the log rolling back down the ramp.