Sagging Roof Insight

[fixtureman]

I would just cut a couple holes in the drywall to get a post to jack it up then use cross ties to hold it from sagging.  It is easy to patch a couple of holes

[Lynden]

Have you seen this guy's videos? He does a pretty good job of explaining the options.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7txb1ik20I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_IPqv-LzzU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8jxBfrOexo

[Large Wooden Badger]

thansk - those are interesting to watch.

[tomsteve]

am i reading that the roof on the house js sagging between the ridge and wall?
if so, is it where the porch roof lays on the house roof?

[MstrCarpenter]

Even when talking to framers, there always seems to be some confusion as to what the various parts of a roof system actually do. Even the drawing assumes the ceiling joists as being part of the roof system, which they can be but not always are. (Yours are not!) When the ceiling joists are nailed to the sides of the rafters, they also become "rafter ties". Rafter ties keep the bottom of the triangle from spreading apart; which in turn keeps the ridge up where it's supposed to be. Rafter ties should be located in the lower third of the run of the rafter, usually at the bottom. (I just put them 2' higher on an enclosed porch last Friday to have a 9' ceiling on 92 1/2" walls.) On the other hand, collar ties keep the top of the roof from opening. They should be in the upper third, or you can use steel banding over the tops. The other two ways of keeping the ridge up there is a ridge beam (collar ties still required), and trusses.

When the joists are perpendicular to the run of the rafters, like yours are, they can't act as a rafter tie. However; by looking at your pictures, I think I can see an easier fix. Even though you have a shallow pitch, it looks like the fascia is lower than the top of the walls; so here's what I suggest. beef up the fascia (front and back) with a 2x6 strong-back. Drill a 3/8" hole through the strong-back, fascia, and wall. feed 1/4" steel cable through  and secure both ends (when reasonably tight) so they can't pull through. Do this about every 4'. Now go inside and put a little weight on the cables. Give the (I assume) bent nails a little encouragement by yanking on the cables, alternating amongst them while checking progress. All of the roof sheathing will have to shift a little in order to raise the ridge, but it will move. I can tell you, by experience, that I can exert more force than I can with a come-along by simply hanging on the cable. I have also slowly pulled a post and beam house and huge barn together by feeding the cable through concrete blocks and giving them a tug or two every day. Now you just have to keep them together with rafter ties. Every other pair is more than enough. (It just passes Code at 4', but that's still a D-)

[Large Wooden Badger]

Interesting.

I intend to take the week of the 4th off, so I'll keep you posted as to how it goes and what works.

[mike4244]

You can tell if the rafters have moved off the plate. Pull an offset line at the eave. I think you will find the eave is bowed out where the roof is sagged. Also if you can access the attic, pull a line under the ridge board. The ridge may be straight. Ridge looks to be correct size for the rafters. Collars probably won't help as the pitch is too shallow. When constructed collars would have helped if they were installed 1/3 of the height above the floor. Collars under the ridge would not done much good.
I think the best fix is too remove the roof and start over.
mike

[Snipe Hunter]

 but it eroded my confidence in home inspectors.
 

It really should have only eroded your confidence in that one inspector. Even Toyota makes a lemon now and then.

Some inspectors really suck. I used one that sucked and it's one of the reasons I went into the business. A good inspector can make a decent living. A fast inspector can make a very decent living.

Most states (still not all) only recently required any formal training and testing for inspectors. Some states still don't require any formal training. I'm not licensed in Washington DC. All I have to do is have a business license in DC and print up some business cards to work there. Even here in Maryland, I'm competing against inspectors who were "grandfathered" and have no formal training. They can keep renewing their license.

The national chains are made up of inspectors who didn't make it working for themselves. It's the only reason an inspector would work for a chain. The chains basically split the money down the middle. Around here, a decent inspector will stay busy with very little outside help. A lousy inspector won't last long on his own. 90+ % of the business is referred from agents and they generally want a thorough report. They need it to properly represent their client and negotiate the sale.

Crappy guys still exist. They're generally thought to be immune to lawsuits but that is changing and as that changes, the cost will go up because insurance will go up and the time to inspect a home will go up. IMHO, it's better and more cost effective for everybody to just hire an inspector with a good track record. It isn't difficult to find reviews.

I compete against inspectors who advertise 1 - 2 hour inspections for 3 bedroom homes and they email the report at the end of the inspection. Customers love it and they get plenty of business. They have no idea what condition the home is in but they only had to miss two hours of work. But there's no way a home can be inspected in less than 3-4 hours. It takes me another two to three hours to write the report.

Judging all inspectors by the actions of one is really a disservice to all involved.

[Cooler]

It really should have only eroded your confidence in that one inspector. Even Toyota makes a lemon now and then.

Some inspectors really suck. I used one that sucked and it's one of the reasons I went into the business. A good inspector can make a decent living. A fast inspector can make a very decent living.

Most states (still not all) only recently required any formal training and testing for inspectors. Some states still don't require any formal training. I'm not licensed in Washington DC. All I have to do is have a business license in DC and print up some business cards to work there. Even here in Maryland, I'm competing against inspectors who were "grandfathered" and have no formal training. They can keep renewing their license.

The national chains are made up of inspectors who didn't make it working for themselves. It's the only reason an inspector would work for a chain. The chains basically split the money down the middle. Around here, a decent inspector will stay busy with very little outside help. A lousy inspector won't last long on his own. 90+ % of the business is referred from agents and they generally want a thorough report. They need it to properly represent their client and negotiate the sale.

Crappy guys still exist. They're generally thought to be immune to lawsuits but that is changing and as that changes, the cost will go up because insurance will go up and the time to inspect a home will go up. IMHO, it's better and more cost effective for everybody to just hire an inspector with a good track record. It isn't difficult to find reviews.

I compete against inspectors who advertise 1 - 2 hour inspections for 3 bedroom homes and they email the report at the end of the inspection. Customers love it and they get plenty of business. They have no idea what condition the home is in but they only had to miss two hours of work. But there's no way a home can be inspected in less than 3-4 hours. It takes me another two to three hours to write the report.

Judging all inspectors by the actions of one is really a disservice to all involved.

Recently a friend was selling his house.  I suggested that he have a house inspection done before he made the sale for two reasons:

1.  It would let him know what a buyer's inspection will reveal and he could decide if he wanted to make those corrections in advance.
2.  If he decided to reveal the inspection report to the potential buyer anything that was revealed within the report would not have to result in a price adjustment after the buyer's inspection. 

Normally if the buyer's inspection reveals $5,000.00 in needed repairs that would be deducted from the agreed upon pricing.  But if the customer knew of the needed repairs in advance because he had seen the seller's inspection report, then he would not have that option.  It would be a part of the description of the property (assuming he decided to show the inspection report). 

It seemed like a good idea to me.  What do you think?

The downside would be that the seller's inspector finds things that the buyer's inspector would have missed.  But I don't think you can count on that happening.

[EricU]

Now go inside and put a little weight on the cables. Give the (I assume) bent nails a little encouragement by yanking on the cables, alternating amongst them while checking progress. All of the roof sheathing will have to shift a little in order to raise the ridge, but it will move. I can tell you, by experience, that I can exert more force than I can with a come-along by simply hanging on the cable. I have also slowly pulled a post and beam house and huge barn together by feeding the cable through concrete blocks and giving them a tug or two every day. Now you just have to keep them together with rafter ties. Every other pair is more than enough. (It just passes Code at 4', but that's still a D-)

how do you keep the wire from just relaxing in between the times you put weight on it? Or does it pull back in and stay?

I was laying out the roof of my shed ant that got me wondering if they just got the angle of the cut on the rafters wrong, and that exaggerates the problem a bit.