Lenmar Finishes

[mr_skittle]

Has anyone had experience with any Lenmar products? I got some at a Benjamin Moore store. I've never heard of it but there are a heck of a lot of finishing products that I've never

 heard of. I was originally hoping to get some Sher-Wood precat lacquer but that didn't work out so well. It only comes in gallons and with a shelf life of 4-6 months once it's catalyzed, 

I'd never use it all. I brought up the idea of splitting the gallon and only catalyzing half of it but the rep discouraged that idea. Wanting to buy local I went to the Benjamin Moore store 

and found some catalyzed conversion varnish. It still only comes in gallons. but with a separate catalyzer I can mix only what I need. It says on the label that its designed to be shelf 

stable for up to 12 months. http://www.lenmar-coatings.com/product-d...on-varnish  I've got a HVLP machine so any input on spraying it would also be appreciated.

[jteneyck]

No experience yet but someone on SMC recently posted that Lenmar is available through BM, so that puts it on my radar.  They have a couple of WB products that look to be worth a try.  So you have the facilities to be able to spray solvent based products?

John

[Rob Young]

Has anyone had experience with any Lenmar products? I got some at a Benjamin Moore store. I've never heard of it but there are a heck of a lot of finishing products that I've never

 heard of. I was originally hoping to get some Sher-Wood precat lacquer but that didn't work out so well. It only comes in gallons and with a shelf life of 4-6 months once it's catalyzed, 

I'd never use it all. I brought up the idea of splitting the gallon and only catalyzing half of it but the rep discouraged that idea. Wanting to buy local I went to the Benjamin Moore store 

and found some catalyzed conversion varnish. It still only comes in gallons. but with a separate catalyzer I can mix only what I need. It says on the label that its designed to be shelf 

stable for up to 12 months. http://www.lenmar-coatings.com/product-d...on-varnish  I've got a HVLP machine so any input on spraying it would also be appreciated.

Looking at the TDS, it seems interesting. But appears to not be a waterborne product as the thinning agent is listed with a part number.  Looking up that part number (1A.406 Thinner) it is listed as "All Purpose Lacquer Thinner" on their web page.

The waterborne vs solvent debate is one you would have to have with yourself if spraying.  PPE, ventilation, cleanup, etc.

Gives the mixed viscosity (I assume that means the catalyst is added) as 28-32 seconds for a #2 Zahn cup.  That would be just below about 20 seconds to maybe 25 max for a Ford #4.  If this is correct, a 2-stage HVLP turbine could easily spray this.  And a decent compressor system would have no issues.  My 4-stage rig, I'd use the 1.3 needle to start and might even be able to use a 1.0.

All in all, looks good on paper and being able to split a gallon is interesting.

[mr_skittle]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I don't have a spray booth per se, but I hang a tarp to partition off the rest of the shop and open up the garage door, set up a big fan, and wear a mask. Fumes and cleanup are no worry to me. I was specifically looking for a catalyzed lacquer because of the durability and the ease in spraying it. I have a 4 stage turbine system so I have no reservations about spraying it. Rob, your tips on viscosity and
on which needle to use is the kind of information that I'm starved for. With experience spraying some in a professional cabinet shop, I'm familiar with spraying technique and progression but am lacking the knowledge of gun setup. Any suggestions on literature about these types of details would be appreciated.

[Rob Young]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I don't have a spray booth per se,  but I hang a tarp to partition off the rest of the shop and open up the garage door, set up a big fan, and wear a mask.  Fumes and cleanup are no worry to me.  I was specifically looking for a catalyzed lacquer because of the durability and the ease in spraying it.  I have a 4 stage turbine system so I have no reservations about spraying it. Rob, your tips on viscosity and
on which needle to use is the kind of information that I'm starved for.  With experience spraying some in a professional cabinet shop, I'm familiar with spraying technique and progression but am lacking the knowledge of gun setup. Any suggestions on literature about these types of details would  be appreciated.

The manual for most guns should have at the minimum a brief chart that translates ranges of viscosity (seconds with a Ford 4 cup for example) to a needle/nozzle/aircap combination.

Ultimately, a quick test spray on some cardboard is in order once the gun is loaded. 

My gun has a pretty rudimentary table so I just use that N/N size as a starting point and then make a note referencing the specific brand.  So far, it has been mostly OK just "goin' for it" using the recommended N/N and letting the viscosity drift a bit to the high side.  For example, (making up a number) the chart says 1.3mm is the recommended size for 20-30 seconds #4 Ford cup viscosity.  I've found I can push that easily to 35 seconds. So if my particular can of whatever reads a bit high, I don't sweat it.


I didn't find any of the durability test notes for the product on a quick search. Did the BM dealer give you some info?

[jteneyck]

Has anyone had experience with any Lenmar products? I got some at a Benjamin Moore store. I've never heard of it but there are a heck of a lot of finishing products that I've never

 heard of. I was originally hoping to get some Sher-Wood precat lacquer but that didn't work out so well. It only comes in gallons and with a shelf life of 4-6 months once it's catalyzed, 

I'd never use it all. I brought up the idea of splitting the gallon and only catalyzing half of it but the rep discouraged that idea. Wanting to buy local I went to the Benjamin Moore store 

and found some catalyzed conversion varnish. It still only comes in gallons. but with a separate catalyzer I can mix only what I need. It says on the label that its designed to be shelf 

stable for up to 12 months. http://www.lenmar-coatings.com/product-d...on-varnish  I've got a HVLP machine so any input on spraying it would also be appreciated.

Here is a link to an article on Homestead Finishing's  website.  Click on "Spraying Paint".  At the bottom of that article is a chart showing the recommended needle size vs. viscosity for gravity, suction, and pressure feed spray guns.  I have found it to work really well for most products with both my gravity and pressure feed guns.  

John

[mr_skittle]

This is the chart from the owners manual. Sorry I can't get it to post in the right orientation. It doesn't list the needle separately. Its part of the "projector set" that includes the needle, air cap, and nozzle. The projector set that I've got is a 3, which is recommended for the water white lacquer. I'm not exactly sure what the "projector set orifice size" refers too. As far as the durability, I didn't seek out this product specifically for that reason. I just knew that catalyzed lacquer is top notch for durability.  Since the project is a bench for the dining room table in a home with two small kids, I know I wanted the most durable surface I could get.    

   

[jteneyck]

This is the chart from the owners manual. Sorry I can't get it to post in the right orientation. It doesn't list the needle separately. Its part of the "projector set" that includes the needle, cap, and tightening ring. I believe the projector set that I've got is a 3, which is recommended for the water white lacquer. I'm not exactly sure what the "projector set orifice size" refers too. As far as the durability, I didn't seek out this product specifically for that reason. I just knew that catalyzed lacquer is top notch for durability.  Since the project is a bench for the dining room table in a home with two small kids, I know I wanted the most durable surface I could get.    

Well that's as clear as mud.  I bought a #4 Ford viscosity cup when I started spraying.  I measure every gallon of finish I open, and use the chart I showed through the link.  No guessing, no surprises.

John

[Rob Young]

This is the chart from the owners manual. Sorry I can't get it to post in the right orientation. It doesn't list the needle separately. Its part of the "projector set" that includes the needle, cap, and tightening ring. I believe the projector set that I've got is a 3, which is recommended for the water white lacquer. I'm not exactly sure what the "projector set orifice size" refers too. As far as the durability, I didn't seek out this product specifically for that reason. I just knew that catalyzed lacquer is top notch for durability.  Since the project is a bench for the dining room table in a home with two small kids, I know I wanted the most durable surface I could get.    

I believe the "projector set orifice size" would be equivalent to the needle size we've been tossing about.  And of course, the needle has to fit (block) the orifice in the nozzle, so the two sizes are interchangeable for all intents and purposes.

However that chart is in inches.

1" = 25.4mm

So we've mentioned 1.3mm and 1.5mm which would be 0.051" and 0.059"

Easy enough to get your hands on a plastic Ford #4 cup through Amazon, https://www.amazon.com/TCP-Thickness-Vis...+cup&psc=1 

Then make up your own chart as you work with different materials.

Keep notes because if you don't write it down, it didn't happen.

[mr_skittle]

I will be picking up a Ford cup ASAP. Going forward I hope to get a lot of use out of my HVLP machine. So while this current gallon of Lenmar will be all I spray for awhile, there will be plenty of other materials being sprayed in the future (like painting my garage).

I would agree that orifice size must be synonymous with needle size. What I've got on the gun now is a #3 which is .051in and I've got a #2 set (.031in) still in the package. Below is another page from the manual detailing the size of each projector set. I think sticking with the #3 will be just fine. 

   

My next question has to do with the setup for the business end of the gun. Hopefully the pictures, along with my description, will make my question clear. 

When installing the air cap, the threaded collar engages right away and everything is held in place ready to spray. If I leave it like this, the nozzle is behind/inside the air cap (first pic).  If I tighten the ring all the way down the nozzle is then poking out past the air cap (second pic). I assume the location of the nozzle in respect to the air cap is an important variable.