Anyone use paint from Ace?

[Kansas City Fireslayer]

I'd like to piggy back on this thread.

I'm about to do some exterior painting (all new) on a shed I am closing in on completion.  

The fascia and soffit will (is) pre-primed pine and 3/8" plywood.
The corner trim will be cement board trim
The siding will be pre-primed cement board (most likely Hardie)

For now it looks like I'm doing this-

1.  Ditching my mainstay- Sherwin Williams.  I think they have screwed the pooch over the last 15 years.
2.  Going with high-quality Latex.
3.  Going to look at Ben Moore and Porter first.  I think there is a PPG store near me as well.

I like to use Flotrol with Latex.  Good idea for exterior as well?

Please opine all you want.

Thanks.


Hooks, I was in business as a painter for years as a side business.  I don't know how many houses I've painted but it's well over 100 on the safe side.  A few thoughts.  If you're siding is bare (non primed) T111 I would definitely use a primer and I'd consider an oil based exterior one.  In my past experiences, latex exterior primers didn't soak into bare wood like oil based ones do.  All waterborne products have really come a long ways over the past 10 years so they may have improved.  You're siding is a vertical surface as opposed to a horizontal wood window sill.  Your siding won't see standing water.  If your pine wasn't pre primed, I would ONLY use an oil based primer on it.  I've seen pine trim fail and peel in as little as 2-3 years when contractors were still triming exteriors with white or yellow pine.  Latex paint doesn't stick to the pitchy pine worth a hoot.  Furthermore, most pine trim is planed smooth, unlike using a rough cedar trim.  I like Smart Trim products because they hold paint exceptionally well and they also resist water absorption very well.  

I would skip the Flotrol for the exterior unless I was brushing a smooth metal door and being OCD about ANY brush marks.  I've never seen Flotrol used on exterior work and you will be thinning the paint.  I would only use a 100% acrylic latex exterior paint on the shed.  I would use satin sheen and I'd never recommend flat paint for any exterior.  Flat paint holds dust and dirt and it will need repainting sooner than a satin sheen.  

I've done little work on cement or Hardie board but I don't recall it having any issues holding paint well.  I would *think* you could go straight to a quality latex and loose nothing over the years.  If there's any doubt, take a scrap and put some latex on it.  Come back in a few days and give it a good finger nail test for adhesion.  

I would brush and roll this shed unless you own a sprayer and you're dying to get your money's worth from it.  If your plywood has deep vertical grooves that's typical in 4 x 8' sheets, I'd get a 1.25" lambs wool roller and extension pole and have at it.  Roll out of a 5 gal bucket with a screen. Paint stores or even the Borg will have these.  If they don't have lambs wool, get a good synthetic.  BM or PPG will have plenty of good paint options.  BM should have a better than average, but not "top of the line", paint for around $30 a gallon if you can sweet talk a partial discount.  With most paint stores, all you have to do is ask for a better price.  SW is a bit tougher though.  

BM and PPG will typically have a more knowledgable staff than SW from my experiences.  If you don't think they know an answer, simply ask them what they're better known contractors are using.  They will know the products their "better" contractors are using.  Better contractor not being the drunk painter who hasn't showered in multiple days....Feel free to adjust your verbage as needed.  Hope this helps. 

P.S.  Make sure to caulk your butt joints, vertical joints where 4 x 8' siding overlaps and overdriven nail holes that pierce the siding deeper than your comfortable with using paint only.  One last thing, it's easy to over buy on your paint when brushing and rolling.  Left over paint that's been tinted can't be returned.  It's easy to blow an extra $50-60 in materials that will sit on the shelf for years and otherwise go unused.  Hope this helps and keep the Advil handy...

[Mags®]

  

         As for matching their computer match isn't even close. I have had depot color match a few times using their computer and it's spot on. I did notice that the tint colors in the machine at ace were quite different from the hd machine not to mention less tint colors in it. I tend to inspect machines... The sign saying no VOC etc in their pigments should have been a red flag... Usually those type statements mean an inferior product at the expense of tree hugging.

         The paint I bought is Aspire (not Aura had it on the mind as some ace used to sell it)  is made by Valspar  which is now owned by SW. There isn't Ben Moore paint available locally as SW has the market here. There is one supplier I know of but it's an hour drive. Ace only carries Valspar here.

         

           The painters I work with all do commercial no residential and they have all switched to behr from SW.  I know I like my paint to stay the color I painted it so I quit buying SW. 

     I have used the behr marquee in light tan and covered a chocolate brown and looked great in one coat. Did spot where I primed before and no difference. It flows out almost like an oil.

       This Aura paint is thicker and just doesn't flow out well. After reading some reviews and other stuff on the net it's a common complaint and most end up adding some floetrol which I don't like to do but this stuff really needs it.

        I had bought some paint in Detroit in the 90s repainting my grandmother's house which was still in the family. It was ffrom a local paint Store with their name and that stuff was very nice and the marine primer was great. Wish I could buy that today.

Okay... First, color matching is a product of software, not paint.  Depending on what each store uses will depend on accuracy.  If they are using 20 year old software, then yeah, their matching ability probably sucks.  Personally we use match rite, which does a reasonably good job, but we never claim to match 100%.  Second, zero voc pigment is the new norm, get used to it, all manufactures have switched.  Benjamin Moore has been using zero voc tint for over 10 years now.  Aspire is Valspar cheap line, you pay for what you get,  it is in no way comparable to Aura...  As for Ace, all stores are individually owned, so it is up to the owner to decide what lines of paint to carry.  Most stores carry Valspar as of late as Ace sold their manufacturing capabilities to Valspar/ SW a few years ago.  Interestingly enough you state that the colorants are different and Ace has less, but I'm curious on how you actually could derive that information?  If they are mixing valspar they are on a digital system, in which all colorants are housed inside a computer controlled dispenser...  Do you have xray vision in which to count the canisters?  

[Woodenfish]

I'm not trying to troll you Robert, but your perceived knowledge of the paint business, qualities of product and tinting methods could not be any more incorrect.

Floetrol is not a recommended product for the use in Benjamin Moore Aura. Ben Moore has their own extender for Aura. Nothing wrong with Ace Hardware lines of Valspar Aspire or Optimus either as they are both well made paints. Just because Valspar was recently purchased by Sherwin Williams does not make these products any different today than they were beforehand. Behr Paint is not a product that quality professional painting contractors who are given a choice would ever choose first.

[Robert Adams]

Okay... First, color matching is a product of software, not paint.  Depending on what each store uses will depend on accuracy.  If they are using 20 year old software, then yeah, their matching ability probably sucks.  Personally we use match rite, which does a reasonably good job, but we never claim to match 100%.  Second, zero voc pigment is the new norm, get used to it, all manufactures have switched.  Benjamin Moore has been using zero voc tint for over 10 years now.  Aspire is Valspar cheap line, you pay for what you get,  it is in no way comparable to Aura...  As for Ace, all stores are individually owned, so it is up to the owner to decide what lines of paint to carry.  Most stores carry Valspar as of late as Ace sold their manufacturing capabilities to Valspar/ SW a few years ago.  Interestingly enough you state that the colorants are different and Ace has less, but I'm curious on how you actually could derive that information?  If they are mixing valspar they are on a digital system, in which all colorants are housed inside a computer controlled dispenser...  Do you have xray vision in which to count the canisters?  

           The store is only 2 years old and all their color matching and mixing equipment is brand new. As for the colorants I was standing rent next to the machine with the lid open while he was refilling two of the tints. I have also done this at depot as well. 

             Not only are there fewer tints but tmy are vastly different in consistency etc. They are all more like basic inks while a number of the behr ones are very different. Like one of the tints that went into the color I needed was a thinner bright purple tint. The behr system has more in its inventory of tints and as such you would assume better color matching qualities.

          Also ran into the behr rep at depot which used to work for valspar and the first thing he mentioned was the lack of additives in valspar to improve flowout and the complaints he got from it. He also said that they had numerous complaints of sall bubbles in the paint after application which was a ph issue that they didn't have the additives to eliminate.

         When I contacted valspar they recommended floetrol which I don't like to do and they didn't hesitate to recommend which means they hear this often. Which I did end up adding about 6 ounces to get it to work fairly well but not as good as even the cheap $7 a gallon stuff I bought at menards once....

            I'll stick with the behr paint in the future as it works well. Wen I try to help a local business I usually get bit in the butt for the deed. Sad part is the Ace Paint cost more than behr and isn't as good. Two gallons at ace with one half price cost more than 2 gallons at depot full price... Course I still get my paint discount at depot so it was less than that for me.

[Mags®]

Keep digging. You have no idea what you are talking about.

[meackerman]

You expect The Behr, former valspar, rep at home depot was going to do anything but sing praises of Behr paint and knock valspar?

[Just_Dave]

Very interesting topic.  Guess I'll toss in my 2 cents.  My dad cut his teeth in the paint business with WP Fuller back in the 40's and 50's.  Fuller paints and stains were top of the line back then.  Dad worked for a company store, and they also carried Valspar as a secondary line.  Dad swore that Valspar was a better paint.  Valspar by brand disappeared in the NW in the 60's.  The name reappeared at Lowes about 8 years ago?  We had just sided dad's house and he insisted we use Valspar.  At this point I should point out that I hate to paint, absolutely hate it.  The Valspar we bought went on like a dream.  I ended up not minding it all.  My daughter loves it and has used it exclusively all over her house.  

Now lets go back a few years prior when I built my shop.  I had a some HD gift cards from rebates so I bought Behr paint for the interior painting.  That paint was absolutely horrid!  Basic white, shaken at the store, I went home and opened it to start putting it on.  It was full of contaminants.  Basically hunks of pealed paint and little bits of grit.  I took it back and they gave me another 5 gallon bucket out of a different lot.  After they shook it we opened it in the store and it seemed fine.  As I started rolling it on there were smaller pieces of the peeled paint.  If I caught it I pulled it out, if not it is still there.  I did go to HD to talk to them about it the next day.  They didn't have much to say other than I should have brought it back...  Lets see I had started painting and I was supposed to stop and take it back?  It is a shop, I let it go..

As for the professional painters using it?  I'd guess they are a bunch of trunk slammers, I don't think I have ever seen any one buying paint at HD that even remotely looked like they were a professional.
All the professionals around here use Rodda or Sherwin Williams.    3 years ago when my house, shop and garage needed to be painted I hired it out.  I knew who I wanted to use, so I told him I wanted the best paint there is.  He used SW Emerald.  Just to keep him in check I got two other bids and told both of the other guys I wanted them to recommend what they would use if it was their house.  Both of them said that Rodda had a decent product but they would go with SW Emerald.

And as a final comment.  If I had brand X paint that I needed an exact match for, I would go back and get more brand X.  If I wanted to just get a close match and not use brand X then I would not even remotely expect to get a perfect match.  I honestly would expect it to be a shade or two off.

[K. L. McReynolds]

I've used many different brands of paint.

By far, the most important part of painting is the preparation. Bad prep means bad job with even the best paint. I sometimes spend more on the primer than on the paint.

SW is my first choice---the store manager at the store I use is good. I did get him the day I asked for a gallon of clear paint.
 

Ace is actually the second go to, before HD. Reason? Better service and good paint. Never had a problem with Ace brands.

Will use Behr if I cannot get paint from SW/Ace. Will not use designer brands(Ralph Lauren) stuff is pure crap.

Just painted the south side of my garage---steel siding. Had a evergreen bush grow against the siding and it caused the factory paint to peel. Used a $56 a gallon primer from SW and donated SW white(Ovation). Rolled this side with small diameter 1/2" nap rollers.

Did the west face of the garden shed(same siding, same peeling---looked like it had been used as a BB gun backstop) and plywood door with Bullseye 123 exterior primer and Valspar(colored from a chip). Sprayed it straight from the can with a new Wagner Power Painter(turbine). Had to back roll it though, Wagner is still sub par. That was two years ago. Still doing fine so far.

My point? Paint is paint. Prep, tools, and technique are far more important.

[Woodenfish]

Very interesting topic.  Guess I'll toss in my 2 cents...
Now lets go back a few years prior when I built my shop.  I had a some HD gift cards from rebates so I bought Behr paint for the interior painting.  That paint was absolutely horrid!  Basic white, shaken at the store, I went home and opened it to start putting it on.  It was full of contaminants.  Basically hunks of pealed paint and little bits of grit.  I took it back and they gave me another 5 gallon bucket out of a different lot.  After they shook it we opened it in the store and it seemed fine.  As I started rolling it on there were smaller pieces of the peeled paint.  If I caught it I pulled it out, if not it is still there.  I did go to HD to talk to them about it the next day.  They didn't have much to say other than I should have brought it back...  Lets see I had started painting and I was supposed to stop and take it back?  It is a shop, I let it go...

Five gallon pails of paint always needs to be strained before using.

[meackerman]

I've run numerous 5 gallon pails through an airless without straining without any problems.  Wasn't HD paint though.