Joining four 2x4 into a square for gardening
#21
If these are simple frames to hold dirt, it's likely that you want to treat them as expendable, lasting only a few seasons rather than going to the trouble and expense of making them last a long time.  Ordinary construction lumber in ground contact will have a very limited life, so does not warrant stainless fasteners in my opinion.  Deck screws have treatments that will be sufficient, even if you use treated lumber (in which case you must use some kind of corrosion resistant screws, because of the corrosive nature of the treatment.)

You should be able to put a couple of 2 1/2" or 3" screws into each corner, through one piece and into the endgrain of the other without splitting.  Screws into endgrain only hold about half as well as into sidegrain, but that should do for a simple frame.  Note that the hole through the first piece should be a clearance hole.  It can be of larger diameter than that into the second, as you do not want the screw's threads to grip the first piece.  The head should pull the parts tight.  If the screw has a narrow shank with no threads on the part that goes through the first piece, then the same size hole is appropriate for both.

#10 screws are pretty big, and are likely the cause of the splitting, but drilling a larger clearance hole should avoid this.  #8 screws, particularly those with an auger tip and no threads near the head, would likely work fine without drilling beforehand.
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#22
(03-20-2017, 08:05 AM)Alan S Wrote: If these are simple frames to hold dirt, it's likely that you want to treat them as expendable, lasting only a few seasons rather than going to the trouble and expense of making them last a long time.  Ordinary construction lumber in ground contact will have a very limited life, so does not warrant stainless fasteners in my opinion.  Deck screws have treatments that will be sufficient, even if you use treated lumber (in which case you must use some kind of corrosion resistant screws, because of the corrosive nature of the treatment.)

You should be able to put a couple of 2 1/2" or 3" screws into each corner, through one piece and into the endgrain of the other without splitting.  Screws into endgrain only hold about half as well as into sidegrain, but that should do for a simple frame.  Note that the hole through the first piece should be a clearance hole.  It can be of larger diameter than that into the second, as you do not want the screw's threads to grip the first piece.  The head should pull the parts tight.  If the screw has a narrow shank with no threads on the part that goes through the first piece, then the same size hole is appropriate for both.

#10 screws are pretty big, and are likely the cause of the splitting, but drilling a larger clearance hole should avoid this.  #8 screws, particularly those with an auger tip and no threads near the head, would likely work fine without drilling beforehand.

Good advice on the drilling and materials. At our previous house I used ordinary construction lumber that someone had given me for free.  It was completely rotted out within three years. When we moved into our new house 17  1/2 years ago, I bought out a local lumber yard's supply of cypress decking.  Cypress is pretty resistant to decay.  Even so, I had to pull everything up after nine years because it was rotting. Modern pressure treated lumber isn't so toxic as the old stuff, and I consider it safe to use in gardens.   A small pressure treated wood bed with my herbs has lasted this whole time with no decay at all.
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#23
Another easy solution is to install a 2 x 2 post in each corner, overlap the framing boards at each corner and drill/screw into post from both boards, thus eliminating end-grain connections. I would (and have) used cedar in lieu of untreated or treated lumber in a garden...
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#24
Drill the proper size holes and you should be good.
When I think a piece might split when driving screws (or after the first one split!) I put a clamp on the sides of the piece, then drive screw.

You could always nail it together. Flatten the nail points first, to prevent splitting.
I long for the days when Coke was a soft drink, and Black and Decker was a quality tool.
Happiness is a snipe free planer
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#25
Traditional lumber is going to rot quickly and you'll be doing it again in a couple of years.

Are you making a raised garden bed or just a border on top of the ground?

I don't know what your application is for but if you used cedar posts as a frame, it would last a very long time and look great.

Otherwise, a composite or cedar in 1x4's is easier to make and replace.

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2017/03/19/...he-people/


 I like the metal angle brackets for corners for an easy fit for your application or just run screws into the ends.
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#26
Thank you all very much, both for your welcome and your advice. A couple went way above my pay-grade for an old fart like me. but I've taken the notes and am headed back to HD to return the Kreg Mini Jig and screws, as I didn't even try to use the Kreg Mini Jig. As for my drill set-up, I set up my B&D 18V as with the drill bit and my new, Ryobi impact driver for the screws. Our goal is just to use the basic wood for a square garden on the ground in our pool deck area.
However, I did pre-drill for the couple of holes I did try to put together. And yes, I've learned the hard way that those #10 are probably too large and now I have one halfway in with a completely stripped head.
I'll pick up the braces, 1-5/8" deck screws for the braces. glue and 2-1/2" Timberlock screws.
I'll probably miss your replies to this second post, but I felt I owed you folks a "Thank You" for giving your time to answer my questions. I've been online since some of the Internet's earliest days in the 80's and this is one of the friendliest forums I've ever had the luck to find. Your care and advice is sincerely appreciated.
I'll let you know what happens.

Steve
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#27
That's because we are friendly and civilized.

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#28
Look at this:
http://lumberjocks.com/projects/306450
Gary

Please don’t quote the trolls.
Liberty, Freedom and Individual Responsibility
Say what you'll do and do what you say.
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#29
Arlin - Thank you very much for your advice and warm welcome. I followed through with the advice that most agreed with and I purchased Gorilla Glue, the Timberlock screws and the brackets.
Just one "little" problem and it was the one that forced me to get help online. One of my old 3-inch wood screws is halfway in with totally stripped head. Hmmmm.and ideas how I can get it out so that I can start from scratch using the advice from here?
Thanks to all!!
Steve
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#30
Removing the stripped screw: apply Vise Grip Locking Pliers (or a Vise Grip clone) to the screw shank and slowly unscrew it.
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