Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven.
#11
  
My wife has requested a new oven. Since she is a trained chefMy wife has requested a new oven. Since she is a trained chef she wants the good stuff, which means a 30” oven.  Unfortunately the wall is framed for 27” ovens.  The cubby is framed using 2x4s with 5/8 sheet rock.

I could move the left wall over 3 inches but that would negatively affect access to the furnace in the pantry located behind this wall.

This cubby will have an 18”drawer for pans at the bottom with a 300 pound double oven unit above it.   What is the easiest way to reframe this cubby to get 3 more 18” inches of space in it?  Would a 2x2 wall support this much weight?  Is there an easier way to frame this?

she wants the good stuff, which means a 30” oven.  Unfortunately the wall is framed for 27” ovens.  The cubby is framed using 2x4s with 5/8 sheet rock.
 
I could move the left wall over 3 inches but that would negatively affect access to the furnace in the pantry located behind this wall.
 
This cubby will have an 18”drawer for pans at the bottom with a 300 pound double oven unit above it.   What is the easiest way to reframe this cubby to get 3 more 18” inches of space in it?  Would a 2x2 wall support this much weight?  Is there an easier way to frame this?


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#12
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
You could rebuilt the nook using 2x4's turned sideways.

A shelf of 2 layers of 3/4 ply for the oven to sit on as well as a soffit above should be plenty strong enough.
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#13
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
Are the side walls of the nook used to structurally support what is above?  If not, I would remove the left side and add a wall oven cabinet for a more finished look that will match the rest of your kitchen.  The cut-outs are exactly sized for the ovens. This  will leave the right side of the picture a finished wall going around the corner.
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#14
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
You don't need "walls" unless they hold up the ceiling and roof. You need a floor-to-ceiling double oven cabinet. Fortunately, you are a woodworker (I assume Smile )

Provided you can deal with the flooring, I'd delete the right wall and replace with a 3/4" plywood cabinet to match existing cabinetry (or make it white). Make it flush to the existing hall wall to avoid flooring issues. Wrap it with your existing baseboard.

Make your lower drawer a bit taller if you can. Even if you skip the traditional toe-kick and build almost to the floor. If I can remember, I'll post my oven cabinet and the lower drawer. Its real neat. Has organizer slots in it.

Mostly look at the ergonomics of using each oven and get it the right height for both as a matter of safety. My single oven plus microwave is installed a tad higher than recommended for this reason.

Weight is of little importance, but should be considered. I used 3/4" plywood cleats under the oven shelf. They don't interfere with the lower drawer either. Plenty strong.

Lastly, dry install the shelves in the cabinet. No glue. Some time in the future, you might need to replace the oven and it may require a different height. Using cleats means you have plenty of strength. Use pocket screws on shelves above the oven, dry fitted as well.
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#15
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
(04-17-2017, 01:34 PM)cams2705 Wrote: Are the side walls of the nook used to structurally support what is above?  If not, I would remove the left side and add a wall oven cabinet for a more finished look that will match the rest of your kitchen.  The cut-outs are exactly sized for the ovens. This  will leave the right side of the picture a finished wall going around the corner.
There is no structural support to this wall.  Both sides of the cubical is set into a cutout into the closet behind which acts as a pantry and also stores the forced air furnace.  As you can see from the image here, the wall is not equal.  Missing in the plans in the house drawings is the small wall on the left of the stove cubby.  I feel this cubby is part of the flow of this kitchen, without it things would look weird.  If I removed the right wall the hallway wall would flow into a cabinet.  The left wall if missing would have a cabinet pop out of the wall half way.  I would like to keep the cubby as it flows better.
  

(04-17-2017, 04:43 PM)Mr_Mike Wrote: You don't need "walls" unless they hold up the ceiling and roof.  You need a floor-to-ceiling double oven cabinet.  Fortunately, you are a woodworker (I assume Smile )

Provided you can deal with the flooring, I'd delete the right wall and replace with a 3/4" plywood cabinet to match existing cabinetry (or make it white).   Make it flush to the existing hall wall to avoid flooring issues.  Wrap it with your existing baseboard.

Make your lower drawer a bit taller if you can.  Even if you skip the traditional toe-kick and build almost to the floor.  If I can remember, I'll post my oven cabinet and the lower drawer.  Its real neat.  Has organizer slots in it.  

Mostly look at the ergonomics of using each oven and get it the right height for both as a matter of safety.  My single oven plus microwave is installed a tad higher than recommended for this reason.  

I think a oven cabinet would look awkward there for the reasons stated.  I am hoping to pair down the existing ends of the cubby by 3 inches.  My first choice would be to move the left side of the cubby over 3 inches but that would impede on the clearance from the furnace in the pantry.

My wife and I looked at the oven, convection/micro combos today looking at height requirements for exactly the reasons you mentioned.  I plan on putting a 15-18" drawer below the oven stack to hold baking pans in.  Above the oven stack i hope to be placing a bookshelf or a storage cabinet.  Whatever I build into this cubby will be trimmed out in hickory to match the kitchen cabinets.


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#16
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
I think that a cabinet would look fine.

Too hard to shave the left wall. The stub wall missing in your plan can easily be deleted. The part that is common to the pantry, no so much. You would destroy the pantry side of the drywall and have to rebuild that part of the wall.

I think you should look at deleting that right side wall and placing a cabinet. It can be flush to the end of the pantry wall or can be inset an inch for a decent shadow line. I would also laminate over the left hand wall with cabinet material to give a consistent look. I might even cover the visible side of that cabinet to the left.

I assume that it is not possible to pull the oven forward even with that cabinet on the left.
Rocket Science is more fun when you actually have rockets. 

"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government." -- Patrick Henry
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#17
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
(04-18-2017, 10:15 AM)Mr_Mike Wrote: I think that a cabinet would look fine.

Too hard to shave the left wall.  The stub wall missing in your plan can easily be deleted.  The part that is common to the pantry, no so much.  You would destroy the pantry side of the drywall and have to rebuild that part of the wall.  

I think you should look at deleting that right side wall and placing a cabinet.  It can be flush to the end of the pantry wall or can be inset an inch for a decent shadow line.  I would also laminate over the left hand wall with cabinet material to give a consistent look.  I might even cover the visible side of that cabinet to the left.  

I assume that it is not possible to pull the oven forward even with that cabinet on the left.

I agree with Mike building walls is much harder than building cabinets that can finish out the end of the run where the ovens are nicely 

Joe
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#18
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
[attachment=2025 Wrote:JGrout pid='7459279' dateline='1492528931'][attachment=2026]
I agree with Mike building walls is much harder than building cabinets that can finish out the end of the run where the ovens are nicely 

Joe

I can now see why everyone thinks a cabinet would fit in nicely here but I think the photo is misleading.  

A little history is in order.  I built this help myself 20 years ago with the help of a friend that knew what he was doing.  I was one of two laborers with one foreman on the sight.  I am not a great framing carpenter but can do it.  I did all the trim work and finish work in the home.  My cabinets were made by a cabinet maker but i assisted on the install.  For the last 17 years my home has been a rental.  I am now returning to finish building my home.  I am taking a year sabbatical from working to finish and repair the home and fill it with custom furniture.  I built the home as a 30 year old ski bum and am now ready to make it worthy of its location in a  nice neighborhood in a high end resort town.  Up to a point I am sparing no expenses on making this home nice.  I feel the history is in order because this project is a huge one and I will be posting a lot of questions as I finish this project 20 years delayed.

Here is why I think the cubby is better over the cabinet.

The cabinet in the first photo to the left of the oven does not belong there.  In the initial build of the home I installed a used Sub Zero fridge that only lasted about 5 years.  When it died the new fridge was just a fraction of an inch wider and the pantry cabinet that was to the left of the fridge was moved to the area it is now which is to the left of the oven.  I will build a new cabinet to fit in the gap on the side of the fridge and this unit will be put into the garage for storage or into a room upstairs.  

Second reason I think the oven cubby is the way to go is, I have had a vision for what this will look like done.  I have a sketchup of how I see the wall to be finished up.  The one detail I will change from this drawing is to possibly create a curve end of the cabinets and bookshelf on the left end of the wall.

For now I am looking into sheetrock steel studs which come in 2" thickness to build the cubby walls.  It is also likely I will be hiring a framing carpenter for a week or two because I will be adding an elevated deck to the master bedroom and don't want to mess that up.  I may have him help this framing job.  I know I could do it but it might take me days as opposed to hours by someone who is confident in what they are doing.


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#19
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
In essence you are framing a cubby that is an over engineered wall cabinet Big Grin

If you really want the drywall look of the cubbie then do as suggested turn the framing the other way to make the opening 3" wider 

IMO you want the home to have custom furniture in a home you built  but the kitchen is secondary and therefore no need for a upgrade other than the high end oven that will go in a drywalled cubby. 

My .02


Joe
There are ways of changing peoples minds that are more effective than others but ultimately they all fall short 



“The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance,”  “It is the illusion of knowledge.” Stephen Fry
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#20
  Re: Expand cubby for a bigger wall oven. by photobug (My wife has requeste...)
I'm not changing my opinion. I think the existing oven installation looks second rate and your proposal doesn't change that. Your further explanation really doesn't help. Perhaps if you were to supply more pictures or flesh out your SketchUp model it would help. I would, without hesitation, lop off the left and right walls and fill in with proper cabinetry.
Rocket Science is more fun when you actually have rockets. 

"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government." -- Patrick Henry
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