under drawer dovetail guide - tips tricks?

[mound]

Hi All, happy holidays! 

Thinking about using the technique illustrated in the attached picture for mounting drawers in a desk I'm building (web-frame construction mounted in F&P cabinet, three side drawers each 16"x6" and a top drawer 3"x24")


Pros? Cons? Max drawer width it's suitable for? Gotchas?  Thanks!

[Joel H.]

Hi All, happy holidays! 

Thinking about using the technique illustrated in the attached picture for mounting drawers in a desk I'm building (web-frame construction mounted in F&P cabinet, three side drawers each 16"x6" and a top drawer 3"x24")


Pros? Cons? Max drawer width it's suitable for? Gotchas?  Thanks!

I did this with a chest of drawers.  A couple of thoughts:

1.  Cut the guides that attach to the drawers first - all of them.  Then leaving the dovetail bit at the same height, trim the frame guides to fit.  the frame guides should be the same thickness as the depth of the dovetail cut.  When you sand them you will make them perfectly the correct fit.

2.  I would put a piece in the middle of the web-frame that the guide is glued to -- this will add strength to the holding power of the guide.

3.  However do not expect the guide to keep the drawer from tipping down.  If there is sufficient weight in the drawer it could destroy the guide in the drawer.  Make piston-fit drawers.  

With the drawer guide, the width of the drawer should be less than twice the depth of the drawer - makes the drawer easier to slide.

Other than that I have nothing further of value to add.

Good luck,
Joel

[barryvabeach]

Mound,  I am not a fan of that construction -  I normally see it on cheaper mass produced furniture where the fit is very sloppy and it does not give a smooth sliding drawer - and as Joel points out it can tip excessively.  Is there any reason you don't want to use the standard setup of piston fitting the drawers to the case?  If you are concerned with getting the sides the right height, just cut them 3/4 inch shorter than the front, and screw in kickers above them . I put in a business card as a spacer when I screw them in, it gives enough space to allow easy in and out without tipping .

[mound]

Mound,  I am not a fan of that construction -  I normally see it on cheaper mass produced furniture where the fit is very sloppy and it does not give a smooth sliding drawer - and as Joel points out it can tip excessively.  Is there any reason you don't want to use the standard setup of piston fitting the drawers to the case?  If you are concerned with getting the sides the right height, just cut them 3/4 inch shorter than the front, and screw in kickers above them . I put in a business card as a spacer when I screw them in, it gives enough space to allow easy in and out without tipping .

Good points, thanks both of you.

For a piston fit drawer, top to bottom between the web-frames makes sense and is easy enough (I suppose that's actually the point of them). My real question I guess is what to do about left to right when the case sides are F&P construction and there is empty space between the web-frame and the sides except the front and back.

Here's my sketch, note there is a 7/8" gap between the left side of the web-frame and the panel (which is floating in grooves cut into the 2" square legs) and there is a 1/4" gap between the right side of the web-frame and the inner panel (which is a 3/4" frame)

   

Do I need additional "rails" inside to fill these empty spaces and act as drawer guides? If so, how tall would they need to be? Could they be mounted to the sides of the web-frames rather than being integral to the case?

Also with the piston fit approach is there any concern with so much wood to wood contact where it needs to slide? Is that not a concern with a good fit and some wax?

   

[DaveR1]

Generally there would be spacers added for the left to right alignment.


Here's an example. This has only one kicker but you can see the spacer on the side.

[mound]

Generally there would be spacers added for the left to right alignment.


Here's an example. This has only one kicker but you can see the spacer on the side.

Thanks! So it is just as simple as using a spacer, nothing integral to the case/carcass.

I think I was overthinking things

[DaveR1]

Thanks! So it is just as simple as using a spacer, nothing integral to the case/carcass.

I think I was overthinking things

Yeah. It's not terribly complicated or at least it doesn't have to be.

[mound]

Yeah. It's not terribly complicated or at least it doesn't have to be.

Left-right spacer is only needed at the bottom?

[DaveR1]

Left-right spacer is only needed at the bottom?

Only needed where the drawer might go off course. In your screenshots it looks like the bottom drawer might be guided by the bottom rail of the right side panel unless you are making the drawer box narrower than the opening. The spacers don't need to, and probably shouldn't, contact the entire drawer side. They can be quite low. 1/2 to 3/4 in. tall.

[barryvabeach]

Left-right spacer is only needed at the bottom?

 
Yes, only at the bottom,  I would make it out of 3/4 stock, but you can go with less,  depending on what you have in mind.   Dave's illustration is good, note that the left to right spacer is normally fastened to the drawer rail - since you don't have to worry about cross grain movement between those two pieces.