Have a tub or so of 'antique' tools, including a couple long jointer planes. Before I move them along, I was wondering if the idea of re-purposing them into a smaller wooden plane in Krenov style would be reasonable - I don't believe they are particularly valuable as-is, but thought the wood is likely to be better than some I can get today.
Is this sacrilege? Will I offend the old tool gods?
I've never done it but if you own the tool and are willing to try it, I don't see why you shouldn't. I had a wooden jointer once before I figured out how to use wooden planes and the iron on it was pretty wide compared to my smoothers and others. Most likely you could grind it down as long as you don't overheat it.
Sounds like an interesting project.
The other option would be to sell what you have and buy materials for a Krenov style plane build.
(11-09-2020, 08:27 AM)nodima Wrote: Have a tub or so of 'antique' tools, including a couple long jointer planes. Before I move them along, I was wondering if the idea of re-purposing them into a smaller wooden plane in Krenov style would be reasonable - I don't believe they are particularly valuable as-is, but thought the wood is likely to be better than some I can get today.
Is this sacrilege? Will I offend the old tool gods?
Have others done this - was it worthwhile?
Sacrilege - Yes. Cutting them up to make hippy Krenov planes? Wow. Taking a plane few woodworkers have and every woodworker needs and converting into a plane that every woodworker has and few need? Yeah. Old tool gods are offended.
Seriously, long planes are probably the most useful in terms of actual building. And old woodies are typically longer and lighter than the longest metal planes (so, better and better). If you don't want them, please find a way to pass them to someone who does. I know there are bunches on ebay, but they won't be around forever. Especially if people are cutting them up to make smoothers.
(11-09-2020, 09:28 AM)adamcherubini Wrote: Sacrilege - Yes. Cutting them up to make hippy Krenov planes? Wow. Taking a plane few woodworkers have and every woodworker needs and converting into a plane that every woodworker has and few need? Yeah. Old tool gods are offended.
Seriously, long planes are probably the most useful in terms of actual building. And old woodies are typically longer and lighter than the longest metal planes (so, better and better). If you don't want them, please find a way to pass them to someone who does. I know there are bunches on ebay, but they won't be around forever. Especially if people are cutting them up to make smoothers.
Sorry you asked?
Absolutely not sorry I asked. On the scale of what they could end up doing, figured being repurposed as a plane would be better than being wall art, turned into coat hooks, or painted like so many saws have been.
Maybe not a Krenov style...but....they were remade into smoothers and molding plane if and when those long jointers should break right at the mouth openings...then you could get a couple smaller plane out of the two ends...even turn them on edge for some Hollow & Rounds....
(11-09-2020, 10:02 AM)nodima Wrote: Absolutely not sorry I asked. On the scale of what they could end up doing, figured being repurposed as a plane would be better than being wall art, turned into coat hooks, or painted like so many saws have been.
First magazine article I ever wrote was accepted by FWW on this subject. Long planes do a job power jointers struggle with. If you have a decent try plane and work with solid wood, you really can skip buying a table saw. You can rip with a bandsaw or circular saw and cleanup your edges with a long plane. That one tool has the ability to replace thousands of dollars of tools and many sqft of shop space.
The job of a smoothing plane is really pretty subjective. It’s not really an essential tool. It does a better faster job than sandpaper in my opinion, or a ROS. But it doesn’t open doors to new possibilities the way a try plane does.
As Bandit said, if the planes are badly damaged, then we shouldn’t be making a fuss over them. Speaking of Bandit, we just had this same conversation in Phillip’s thread and Bandit posted a picture of turn of the century carpenters proudly displaying their long planes.
BTW, FWW wanted me to change my article to a review of modern long planes. I refused and moved to PWW where I was never forced to do a tool review or to write anything I didn’t want to do. Pretty sure I posted my submission and plenty of people have written about long planes since, but there are still many woodworkers who don’t have them and really do need them.
In my opinion, every woodworker should have a long wooden plane and know all the techniques and tricks. It’s a basic skill like using hand saw. I don’t know what it means to “be a better woodworker” but I think this one tool increases ones capabilities and repertoire for little money, space, or skill.
(11-09-2020, 10:56 AM)adamcherubini Wrote: First magazine article I ever wrote was accepted by FWW on this subject. Long planes do a job power jointers struggle with. If you have a decent try plane and work with solid wood, you really can skip buying a table saw. You can rip with a bandsaw or circular saw and cleanup your edges with a long plane. That one tool has the ability to replace thousands of dollars of tools and many sqft of shop space.
The job of a smoothing plane is really pretty subjective. It’s not really an essential tool. It does a better faster job than sandpaper in my opinion, or a ROS. But it doesn’t open doors to new possibilities the way a try plane does.
As Bandit said, if the planes are badly damaged, then we shouldn’t be making a fuss over them. Speaking of Bandit, we just had this same conversation in Phillip’s thread and Bandit posted a picture of turn of the century carpenters proudly displaying their long planes.
BTW, FWW wanted me to change my article to a review of modern long planes. I refused and moved to PWW where I was never forced to do a tool review or to write anything I didn’t want to do. Pretty sure I posted my submission and plenty of people have written about long planes since, but there are still many woodworkers who don’t have them and really do need them.
In my opinion, every woodworker should have a long wooden plane and know all the techniques and tricks. It’s a basic skill like using hand saw. I don’t know what it means to “be a better woodworker” but I think this one tool increases ones capabilities and repertoire for little money, space, or skill.
Interesting thoughts - I have settled on the Stanley/bailey variety for my hand planes, and try to use my #8 as often as possible. While I have an 8" jointer, it really gets used as an initial roughing tool. As you point out, at a certain point, it becomes easier/more practical/safer to bring a tool to the work, rather than the opposite.
I don't believe the planes are damaged, but would absolutely need a good fettling to get them sorted out, as well as attention to sharpening the blades.
Was the article for PWW something recent? I had a subscription for a while, and still have the issues, but let the sub lapse a year or two ago. If it is older than that, what is the issue number, and I'll dig it up.
(11-09-2020, 11:39 AM)hbmcc Wrote: I read somewhere that after steel took over the market, people used the woodies for kindling and firewood.
I recall reading that too. Maybe Pat Leach? I don't believe any part of that is true.
Like so many other things in our world, the market doesn't always select the best. In the US, furniture making shifted from small shops building high end furniture, to factories making crap. Similar to other products, the market for planes, saws, and chisels changed from trained and skilled professional customers, to DIY settlers moving west, never to be seen again. Tools that were once made by master craftsmen for master craftsmen, were mass produced and shipped West by Sears and Roebuck, the amazon.com of the 19th c. So what became a market leader, wasn't necessarily best or even fit for purpose.
For example:
When you are gluing up a long joint for a table top, you want the longest plane you can get. A 36" wooden plane probably beats a 24" S#8 (I say probably because the woodies soles can warp or twist). Iron width is another factor for ye olde glewing joynter. Mine is 2-7/8" which is just enough width to match plane 6/4 rough stock. A #8 is 2-5/8". A S#7 is 2-3/8" both too narrow for that job. I agree about weight and friction. Less is better for both and woodies take the W for that too.
Here is the thread I was talking about earlier: https://forums.woodnet.net/showthread.ph...83&page=12
What I like about this thread is that its a real project. We sometimes get lost talking about tools in theory. If you are building a solid wood top to a large-ish project, that's actually not so easy with conventional and even nice power tools. Furniture factories use (or used to use) these tools because training consists of a safety briefing. But that doesn't make the ubiquitous 8" jointer a better solution to a long wooden plane for people making furniture. I think the thread above does a better job explaining this than I can.
IMHO- every furniture making woodworker should have a 26" try plane and maybe a 30"+ long wooden jointer. Don't burn them. Don't cut them up. They are probably the best tools of their type and among the most important tools any serious woodworker owns.
Here are some pictures of the planes. I dug out 5 ranging from 22 to 30 inches. One of the is actually a round bottom plane, which I may have a use for in an upcoming project involving a coopered door
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