Cross-grain Planing successes

[Derek Cohen]

So Schwarz says no tearout planing across the grain, but then admits you "splinter" the far edge of the board. I would call that tearout.

I would call that "spelching"


Regards from Perth

Derek

[wmickley]

So Schwarz says no tearout planing across the grain, but then admits you "splinter" the far edge of the board.  I would call that tearout.  His teaser pic is of a high angle smoother, and he ends his blog entry by touting a high angle plane as an alternate approach.  Which to me implies planing across the grain doesn't always work to avoid tearout.  In my experience flattening a board using a jointer or jack with a highly cambered blade to take down the high spots, I get tearout - which is fine until I'm ready to get to the final smoothing.

Sellers has a good video on why cross-planing might work better for flattening a board.  It has a lot to do with the grain and not the fact that you've simply decided to plane cross grain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m231_HKCOWs

I think Schwarz and Sellers make planing videos and then when taping is done go back to their real methods, which is machine work.

If you are getting tear out from a jointer or try plane, something is wrong.

I watched 1:25 of the Sellers video. He says that if a board is cupped by 1/16, then you need to take 1/16 off each side for a total loss of 1/8. However, when we do this work by hand, we only plane the edges on one side and only in the middle on the other. The loss is less than 1/8 and anyone with significant experience would know that.

[adamcherubini]

I must be missing something.  I would NEVER plane cross grain without skewing the plane significantly. The motion may be 90 degrees, but the blade isn't oriented that way.  Also, I would never use a block plane for this for a whole host of reasons- too short, and most importantly, my block plane has crispy square edges on its blade.  I plane cross grain often and without thinking about it as being different, and always with a longish plane with a curved iron. BTW, the square edge CAN work, but depth of cut would need to be miniscule. The amount of wood removed by a planing operation is a significant factor in the technique and tool used.  As an 18th c style worker, I tend to expect fairly thick shavings.  I don't have a machine to get me close. I think this changes things, as Warren is suggesting.

[rwe2156]

So Schwarz says no tearout planing across the grain, but then admits you "splinter" the far edge of the board. I would call that tearout.

I would call that "spelching"


Regards from Perth

Derek

Spelching?  Now that's a new ww'ing term to me!!

Wait, I always thought spelching was associated with ale drinking Down Under..................

[C. in Indy]

OK,  I have a few "NEVER DO THIS" inputs.    Is there no middle ground between doing it 100% of the time (which I did not describe),  doing it 5% of the time (which I DID promote), and doing it 0% of the time ?

[hbmcc]

SNIP>

I watched 1:25 of the Sellers video. He says that if a board is cupped by 1/16, then you need to take 1/16 off each side for a total loss of 1/8. However, when we do this work by hand, we only plane the edges on one side and only in the middle on the other. The loss is less than 1/8 and anyone with significant experience would know that.

This reminds me of a high school/jr. high(?) problem presented by a history teacher. He was shortening a wood screen door by using lapped joints. As I recall, most of the class failed the test for shortening the frame styles, including him with a door too short. 

I can forgive Sellers his error, only if he is not a math person. I had to draft the solution to Mickley's cup problem. There is no way I would trust math for a solution.

Now, to Chris in Indy's missive:
I would technically point out a "middle ground" as 50-percent, or there-about. 5-percent just doesn't cut the mustard. 


Finally, I always associate "spelch" first with shards of stone sloughing off limestone buttes and then think, why plane a rock?

My twenty cents--

[adamcherubini]

I think Schwarz and Sellers make planing videos and then when taping is done go back to their real methods, which is machine work.

If you are getting tear out from a jointer or try plane, something is wrong.

I watched 1:25 of the Sellers video. He says that if a board is cupped by 1/16, then you need to take 1/16 off each side for a total loss of 1/8. However, when we do this work by hand, we only plane the edges on one side and only in the middle on the other. The loss is less than 1/8 and anyone with significant experience would know that.

Warren I think you live for this sort of stuff. I’m just now catching on. So you are saying Paul measured the maximum extent of this stock? Such that if one side is concave by a 1/16” the other side must be convex by a 1/16” but when corrected the edge will only be 1/16 thinner than it started?

So if Paul had a 1” thick board cupped 1/16” it would measure 1-1/18” if laid on a surface plate. You are blowing my mind. So he started with a 1” thick board, planed 1/16 from both faces and is left with a board 15/16” thick?

Yeah, I don’t measure boards on a surface plate either. I measure an edge.

I think this is pretty esoteric, even for us.

[Philip1231]

A short video showing cross grain planing I mentioned above:

Planing Bevel Cross Grain

[Derek Cohen]

Finally, I always associate "spelch" first with shards of stone sloughing off limestone buttes and then think, why plane a rock?

Quoting our Megan, who is past being a student of English ....

“The Oxford English Dictionary cites 1605 as the earliest example of the word “spelch,” translated from the Scottish, to mean splinter. According to the OED, the word is obsolete – but it is not. As woodworkers know, it’s a more genteel way of saying “blow out the backside” – as in, “planing crossgrain will cause the wood to spelch on the far side of the cut.” (But “blow out the backside” will get you a few chuckles in a classroom setting.)” in FWW.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[bandit571]

The hand plane way Sellers uses to raise a panel...without having to buy a raised panel plane..

   
I first flatten the panel...

   
Stanley #4, Type 10 to mill a bevel...going at a diagonal to the grain....

   
But, once the top stop line has been cut, I switch back to the jack plane ( no camber on it's iron) and finish to the lines, going across the grain, until the bevel is flat and uniform.
I do both end grain ends first...then the long grain sides..

   
Until a nice, crisp corner appears....and no tear outs to be seen....