How to winterize water lines in a vacant rental property?
#11
My mom has a small rental home in norther Missouri, prolly 900 sf, pier & beam home, one story.  No one will be living in it over the winter and there is no one in the area able to "check" on the house.  So we want to "winterize" it.

We plan on putting the heat on to 60 or so degrees, shut the water off, open the faucets, flush the toilet and drain the water heater.  We'll also pour safe antifreeze in the toilet and p traps.

We're in Dallas and we won't know if the furnace fails, if it does, we don't want broken water lines due to freeze.  Is it necessary to get the water out of all the water lines to prevent freeze damage should the heat fail?  If so, how does one do that?  There are no plumbing openings in the house except the normal kitchen & bathroom faucets / toilet and washer connection.  There is an outside hose bib.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.

chris.
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#12
While I only visit such climates, I question the need to leave the heat on.

Properly draining the water lines, shutting everything off, etc. should take
care of it.

I'd be more concerned if the furnace caught something on fire. Why heat
an empty building?
Mark Singleton

Bene vivendo est optimum vindictae


The Laws of Physics do not care about your Politics   -  Me
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#13
I used to help a plumber 40 years ago do that for a number of buildings the company owned. He would shut off the water, blow out the lines with compressed air, dump undiluted regular antifreeze (not rv) and blow the lines again. then put antifreeze in the wash machines, dishwashers, etc. He would write it down every year exactly what he did, I told him to ask a secretary to type them up and he would have a checklist, but he didn't want to-probably job security.

I would say if it has water, to remove it. Reason he used automotive antifreeze was it would mix with water and not be diluted like RV. It wasn't as good for animals or environment, but he never had things freeze and break.
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#14
(09-21-2021, 07:59 PM)toolmiser Wrote: I used to help a plumber 40 years ago do that for a number of buildings the company owned.  He would shut off the water, blow out the lines with compressed air, dump undiluted regular antifreeze (not rv) and blow the lines again.   then put antifreeze in the wash machines, dishwashers, etc.  He would write it down every year exactly what he did, I told him to ask a secretary to type them up and he would have a checklist, but he didn't want to-probably job security.

I would say if it has water, to remove it.  Reason he used automotive antifreeze was it would mix with water and not be diluted like RV.  It wasn't as good for animals or environment, but he never had things freeze and break.

So I open the cold or hot side of a faucet and blow compressed air in and it will come out elsewhere?  Seems like some water would get trapped somewhere.  I'd think it would need a friendly path to follow.  I don't think the water shut off area has any capacity to insert compressed air.
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#15
(09-21-2021, 08:15 PM)chrisntam Wrote: So I open the cold or hot side of a faucet and blow compressed air in and it will come out elsewhere?  Seems like some water would get trapped somewhere.  I'd think it would need a friendly path to follow.  I don't think the water shut off area has any capacity to insert compressed air.

Your water heater has a drain. If it's a tank type, after you drain it, it can store compressed air up to about 60 psi. Unless it is relatively new, I wouldn't go higher than the current water pressure. (If water pressure blows a tank, it's loud and messy. Blow it with compressed air and it's explosive!) Use this air to blow out the water lines. I think I would take my chances that I got enough water out over putting toxic antifreeze in domestic water supplies. 

After fixing leaks every spring for years, I re-plumbed our camp with PEX. I ran 3/4" hot and cold "mains" from end to end pitched to a pair of sill-cocks, with 1/2" take-offs as needed along the way. To "winterize"; first, and always first, cut power to the water heater and pump. Then we simply open every faucet and pour RV antifreeze into the traps. (The hot faucets will draw air while the heater drains) There's a few more steps to drain the pump/pressure tank, and we change the water filter leaving it dry. By then it's time to close the valves to keep bugs out and shut off the power. There's no water, heat, or electricity to worry about.
Sign at N.E. Vocational School Cabinetmaking Shop 1976, "Free knowledge given daily... Bring your own container"
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#16
Here goes a long list.
  
  Is there a monitored alarm system on the house?  If there is, have a temp sensor installed as a separate zone.  How would you deal with squatters that moved in?

  Is there a handyman in the area that could be called to check if there is an alarm?
  
  There is more than water lines to worry about, what  about the incoming service and meter?  A curb stop is supposed to be self draining when its shut off, this would be a good thing to have done and checked, a heat tape and some insulation on the meter should prevent it freezing and breaking if the heat fails.  
  
  In order, kill the energy supply to the water heater, close the incoming water supply valve, open all faucets, drain water heater and disconnect washing machine hoses, use an RV blowout fitting and blow compressed air into hot and cold lines from the washer hoses to each faucet.  When the incoming water supply is off at the curb stop, open the unions at the water meter and allow to drain before insulating and plugging in heat tape.  Pour antifreeze into washing machine and dishwasher, set to drain cycle and run to pump out and fill pumps with antifreeze.  Pour antifreeze into all P traps.

  If equipped, install a new filter into heating system.  If there is a softener, let me know and I'll add info on that.

  Everything that immediately pops to mind, if I think of anything else I'll add it and fire away if you have other questions.
Blackhat

Bad experiences come from poor decisions. So do good stories. 


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#17
Thank you for replying and giving tips on what to do.  It is greatly appreciated.  I think I can take it from here, now that I know where and how to introduce air into the system.  I called the small city, they don't have self draining shut offs at the street.   It's a very small and old house (1940s? with some upgraded plumbing), no alarm, not really anyone to monitor the house in the small town, population of about 1600.
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#18
If winterizing is going to be a regular thing, I would install a tee with a valve at the low point(s) in the system to drain it. My grandpa did this with his house in Alaska when he built it, and never had any problems when he left for extended periods.

Obviously draining the water heater, etc., needs to be done as well, but this is an easy way to drain the rest of the house.
Dave Arbuckle was kind enough to create a Sketchup model of my WorkMate benchtop: http://www.arbolloco.com/sketchup/MauleSkinnerBenchtop.skp
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#19
My parents used to winterize their summer home in upstate New York (it gets plenty cold there).

They drained the water from the system.  It seems pretty fool proof.  But you will have bleed the system when you turn it on in the beginning of the season.
No animals were injured or killed in the production of this post.
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#20
I winterize our family cabin every winter. I drain the lines, water heater and toilet. The toilet can be made easier with a small wet and dry vac. Missing water can't freeze. I then pour antifreeze in the traps and toilet. I don't like the RV antifreeze. It'll turn to a hard slush, but it works well enough.
Matt

If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
-Jack Handy

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