Question about putting frame on solid wood top

[fowleri84]

After using cheap desks for years, I've decided I'm going to use solid wood now. I like the look of maple. I'm going to get a 30x60 top and use a metal frame with it.

My concern is I've read that solid wood can move. I live in Florida. My room humidity is usually between 40 and 50, being 45% the average. Temperature around 76.

When installing the screws in the wood top, I don't know if there will be space to allow for movement since is a metal frame. This is the frame I wanted to use, i dont think it would allow for movement, now i dont know what frame to get or what base, id rather use a metal frame so i don't have to spend more money on wood

I thought about getting a couple of metal drawer units, drill a wider hole on the top of them, place the top and drill from under

https://www.upliftdesk.com/o-leg-seated-...ble-frame/

[srv52761]

yes. the table top will move.
But, almost all of the movement will be across the grain.  You need only worry about the amount of wood between the  screws width-wise.  On your last diagram it looks like screws will go through a flat on a metal channel (could be a u-channel?)

some options.  
 - elongate the holes near the width ends of that frame
- skip those four screws on the width ends altogether and drill holes in those metal cross pieces, just secure with screws going lengthwise down the middle.

[fowleri84]

I think is just the drawing, if you look at the second photo, you can see the holes are somewhat elongated

Here is another photo



this is where the screws would go with my top, so I would have to put 3 screws on each side and 2 in the middle. I don't know if I can get away without putting those in the middle.

The holes seem slotted, but i emailed them for a better picture

When you say the movement will be across the grain, it means from front to back rather than side to side?



anyway here are the instructions, i honestly dont know if it will work.

https://www.upliftdesk.com/content/pdfs/...ctions.pdf

I'm looking for other options but i cant find anything that looks as good. There are steel legs with slotted holes on amazon, but I don't know if it would work with a 60 inch desk without middle support?

The slots on these legs are big enough

https://www.amazon.com/Pack-Square-Recla...pd_bxgy_1/

Here is another one
https://www.amazon.com/Lehom-Dining-Comp...=pd_sbs_1/

[fredhargis]

The instructions really don't address wood movement, nor are they clear enough (to me) to indicate if they allowed for wood movement with elongated holes, though the illustrations seem to show that. You could use that frame and just screw down the center most portion, though having it fastened on the edges would be a good idea.But if the holes aren't elongated you will either have to 1) do the center screw only trick or 2) makes the holes elongated. Probably the easiest wat to do that would be to drill another hole next to (and close to) the existing ones, and use a rat tail file to make them one hole. The file cabinet trick you suggested will also work as an alternative. But as mentioned, solid wood will move...but you only need to address that movement across the grain.

[fowleri84]

I don’t understand the “across the grain”. Does this mean that I’m facing the desk, the movement will only happen from front to back and viceversa, and not from left to eight. In other words, it will happen in the depth of the top, not the width.

I know some people refer width as length and depth as width. If my desk is 30” deep, it will happen across that?

Which means the holes have to be elongated in the direction of the depth of the top?

The problem here is this frame, the holes on the sides are correct, but the two holes in the middle if the frame are horizontal. Would this be a problem? If the wood is going to move from front to back, that horizontal hole wouldn’t allow for movement.

The file cabinet works but it has to be wood cabinet so i can do the elongated holes with ease and I’d need two cabinets which would have to be real wood cause it wouldn’t make sense to buy a solid wood top and pair it with fake wood cabinets. That’s more money I’ll have to spend.

These solid wood cabinets are expensive too. I can’t find anything below $300 unless they’re night stands

My best bet is to use those metal legs i posted from amazon, their elongated holes are 10mm x 20mm. My top would be 1 inch thick.

If I use a #10 x 3/4 wood screw and a #10 washer with a one inch outside diameter. This would give enough room for the screw to move and the washer would help

Here are the legs. My only concern is that top I’ll be getting will be 30x60 or 30x55. I don’t know if just two legs would be enough. What if overtime I get a bow on the middle of the top?

https://www.amazon.com/Lehom-Dining-Comp...=pd_sbs_1/

Id rather use that frame I posted initially tho since it has that middle support. I emailed that company asking about how big the holes are

[fredhargis]

I don’t understand the “across the grain”. Does this mean that I’m facing the desk, the movement will only happen from front to back and viceversa, and not from left to eight. In other words, it will happen in the depth of the top, not the width.

YES

I know some people refer width as length and depth as width. If my desk is 30” deep, it will happen across that?

Again...YES

Which means the holes have to be elongated in the direction of the depth of the top?

The holes need to run across the depth (front to back), so YES.

The problem here is this frame, the holes on the sides are correct, but the two holes in the middle if the frame are horizontal. Would this be a problem? If the wood is going to move from front to back, that horizontal hole wouldn’t allow for movement.
I don't exactly follow, but if the top is secured in the middle, and can move on eac outside edge...you're good to go. It will just move form the center out on both sides.

The file cabinet works but it has to be wood cabinet so i can do the elongated holes with ease and I’d need two cabinets which would have to be real wood cause it wouldn’t make sense to buy a solid wood top and pair it with fake wood cabinets. That’s more money I’ll have to spend.

These solid wood cabinets are expensive too. I can’t find anything below $300 unless they’re night stands

My best bet is to use those metal legs i posted from amazon, their elongated holes are 10mm x 20mm. My top would be 1 inch thick.

If I use a #10 x 3/4 wood screw and a #10 washer with a one inch outside diameter. This would give enough room for the screw to move and the washer would help

Good plan, just don't use flat head wood screws.

Here are the legs. My only concern is that top I’ll be getting will be 30x60 or 30x55. I don’t know if just two legs would be enough. What if overtime I get a bow on the middle of the top?

That's possible depending on the weight piled on it.

https://www.amazon.com/Lehom-Dining-Comp...=pd_sbs_1/

Id rather use that frame I posted initially tho since it has that middle support. I emailed that company asking about how big the holes are

Good luck!

[fowleri84]

Thank you for the help. I'm a complete noob at all of this. 

My point was this, you said that movement will happen across the grain, which is front to back. The 3 holes on the legs are placed correctly for this as they are facing you, but the two holes on the middle frame, where the two arrows are, they are facing horizontal, as you can see in this photo. The middle support bar holes are not running across the depth, front to back.

If the wood will move across the grain, and I only use the support bar hole, this horizontal hole wouldn't allow for movement?

Basically what I want to know is if I only use one screw in the middle, what are the chances of a crack developing there? or does wood only move on the outside edges?

I contacted the manufacturer and they said all their frames come with oval shaped holes for the screws to account for expanding solid wood. They have no photos.




also would this type of screw work, roundish head

[Gary G™]

There are numerous forums with discussions about wood movement.
Will your purchase be full length boards jointed at the edges or interlocking quasi-random length pieces like many butcher block slabs?

https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/51587

So long as you don’t leave the windows open and keep the A/C fairly constant year round, you will have very minimal seasonal movement.

[fredhargis]

Across maybe 4-5 " wood movement is small enough that's it's not an issue. My guess is the holes that are elongated crosswise (the ones in the center of the frame) are close enough to the center of the table top they will be OK. It seems to me that company is fairly clueless about wood movement based on the way they set up those holes. Regardless, you have the right type of screw there (those are called "pan head") and you should be good to go.  No, wood does not just move at the edges. The movement is caused by absorption of moisture in the air, causing the swelling of the fibers. The opposite occurs when the air dries out. Hence the statement made by Gary G about the conditioned living space. The fibers do not swell appreciably along their length....only the width. That is the concern you are addressing. The screw type is to allow the screw to slide along the frame member as the wood expands. Now, if it's anchored in the center the wood will move in the direction of least resistance...from the center out on both sides. I hope this made sense.

[fowleri84]

This is top I’m going to get. I don’t know if is full length boards or the other option

https://www.tablelegs.com/custom-maple-t...solid-wood