Adjusting wooden planes
#10
So I'm working on making a bookcase, and the plan is for the back to be a few panels with tongue and groove between them.  I realized this was coming a few months ago, and looked at the available option.  LN's T&G plane is not in stock.  The LV addition for the plow plane probably works, but struck me as potentially fiddly.  Which left old woodies as an option.  I've seen people use woodie T&G planes before, and they have always seemed so smooth.

So I bought a pair from Patrick Leach a few months ago.  Advertised as a good user, just needs a sharpening.  Granted, with the few things I've bought from him in the past I've always found they need a bit more work, but that's fine.  So I finally got around to trying the planes on some scrap today since I'm at the stage where I need to prepare the back on the bookshelf.  Sharpened the blades up, and they can easily take thin slices of wood when I hold the blades by hand.  Try putting the planes together and it is a disaster.  Note, I live in Houston, so it is possible humidity has something to do with this.  I can put the blade in, and then the wedge.  But I'm having a heck of a time adjusting anything.  So much so that I've managed to badly dent the end of the groove plane when trying to get the wedge loose.

So my understanding is that to adjust you put in the blade, tap the wedge in place, and then you can adjust the cut by tapping the plane on the end (backside to retract blade, front to advance).  Then tap the wedge to make it snug.  This isn't working for me.  I'm at tap wedge, blade will not move, then no matter how much I wail on the plane I can't get the wedge loose.  Eventually grab wedge in bench vise and pull place upwards to release, hopefully not hitting myself in the process. 

I've tried fiddling with wooden plane in the past and this has always been a problem, so I think it is partially technique.  I've also got another wooden plane that does a decorative cut (kinda like two beads, but their is no fence) and I've always struggled with this one too. 

So some questions.
1) how tight should the wedge be when sliding into the socket (with no blade in place).  The T&G planes were really tight.  I couldn't even get one of them fully seated initially.  I sanded the wedges some to make it easier, but they still require a bit of force to get in place.  Is this correct?  Or should they be looser, and only tight once it starts pressing on the blade?
2) Is my adjustment technique correct?  I've tried a few different mallets.  A really tiny one, a small rawhide (this is the one that put dents in the end), and a heavier one with a rubber face (if this makes a difference).
3) Any other suggestions/things to look for?  I have a hunch that I need to adjust the skate on the plow that cuts the groove, and I might ask about that later, but I'm having problems adjusting both so I figured one thing at a time.

Mark

Reply
#11
In response to question 1.
On the planes I have if I put in the wedge without the iron they pretty much fall into the socket. Once the iron is in they snug up and it doesn't take too much of a tap to get the wedge to hold the iron in place. You may want to check and make sure the socket has everything straight as it should be.
Reply
#12
Mark,  I bought a set from England,  and some wedges were so stuck I thought I would never get them out.   
Without the iron, IMO, the wedge should go in smoothly, I haven't checked recently, but my guess is that it would never get tight, or if it did, it would be at the very end.  On mine,  I used a card scraper to scrape the sides of the wedge ( not the top or bottom ), then tested the fit.  You want a very slight friction - you might try with marking it with a pencil or chalk, and see where it is rubbing.  Also , check the plane body to make sure the channel is smooth.

For setting, I would not tap the wedge, instead, I would first put the blade in,  then insert the wedge by hand, then use a piece of scrap held in your hand to the bottom of the blade  ( this is for a dado plane, but I think it would work the same for yours ) and fiddle with the projection of the blade until it is cutting the way you want, or a littlle less than desired, then tap the wedge.  It should lock the iron in place.  If not, look at the underside of the wedge - that bears against the iron,  I like it to be a very slight hollow - say .001, from the leading edge to where the wedge meets the top of the plane body.  If instead it is convex, the plane will choke and never work right.

Once you made the initial setting, then tried it,  if it is a little too aggressive, I use a small wooden hammer to hit the top front ( some planes have a strike button there )  inertia should cause the blade to retract a bit,  try it , and it if is fine, tap the wedge to lock it. Another option is to tap the back of the plane near the heel, that should retract the blade a tiny bit.    If it is not aggressive enough, top the end of the iron.  You could also tap the front of the plane near the heel.   

If you find you have a really hard time getting the wedge loose, one suggestion was to turn the plane upside down, and swing it so that the top near the front hit the bench.  This is the same effect as hitting the top strike button, but you are spreading the force over a large part of the plane to minimize nicks and damage to the plane. 

If you look at old infills, it is pretty common to see the strike button worn down from being tapped, check the second photo down  and in many cases the front bun is worn down or cracked.
Reply
#13
(12-07-2021, 08:37 PM)barryvabeach Wrote: Mark,  I bought a set from England,  and some wedges were so stuck I thought I would never get them out.   
Without the iron, IMO, the wedge should go in smoothly, I haven't checked recently, but my guess is that it would never get tight, or if it did, it would be at the very end.  On mine,  I used a card scraper to scrape the sides of the wedge ( not the top or bottom ), then tested the fit.  You want a very slight friction - you might try with marking it with a pencil or chalk, and see where it is rubbing.  Also , check the plane body to make sure the channel is smooth.

For setting, I would not tap the wedge, instead, I would first put the blade in,  then insert the wedge by hand, then use a piece of scrap held in your hand to the bottom of the blade  ( this is for a dado plane, but I think it would work the same for yours ) and fiddle with the projection of the blade until it is cutting the way you want, or a littlle less than desired, then tap the wedge.  It should lock the iron in place.  If not, look at the underside of the wedge - that bears against the iron,  I like it to be a very slight hollow - say .001, from the leading edge to where the wedge meets the top of the plane body.  If instead it is convex, the plane will choke and never work right.

Once you made the initial setting, then tried it,  if it is a little too aggressive, I use a small wooden hammer to hit the top front ( some planes have a strike button there )  inertia should cause the blade to retract a bit,  try it , and it if is fine, tap the wedge to lock it. Another option is to tap the back of the plane near the heel, that should retract the blade a tiny bit.    If it is not aggressive enough, top the end of the iron.  You could also tap the front of the plane near the heel.   

If you find you have a really hard time getting the wedge loose, one suggestion was to turn the plane upside down, and swing it so that the top near the front hit the bench.  This is the same effect as hitting the top strike button, but you are spreading the force over a large part of the plane to minimize nicks and damage to the plane. 

If you look at old infills, it is pretty common to see the strike button worn down from being tapped, check the second photo down  and in many cases the front bun is worn down or cracked.
..........................
If not, look at the underside of the wedge - that bears against the iron, I like it to be a very slight hollow - say .001, from the leading edge to where the wedge meets the top of the plane body. If instead it is convex, the plane will choke and never work right.

This /\...............You can also scrape some ordinary chalk between the wedge and the iron...If the iron won't stay tight, scrape some rosin on the frog to hold it. You can still buy powdered rosin or buy a plug of it for violins etc. Chalk to reduce friction, rosin to increase it.
Often Tested.    Always Faithful.      Brothers Forever

Jack Edgar, Sgt. U.S. Marines, Korea, America's Forgotten War
Get off my lawn !
Upset





Reply
#14
Hi Mark, 

I've gotten pretty good at adjusting wooden planes and I have several metal versions for comparison.  If you want to experiment with them, let me know.

Mark B in SL
Mark in Sugar Land, TX
Reply
#15
Mark, I have three planes to use for T&G, and have used them all. All metal: LN #48, Veritas Small Plow and Combination planes.

I would MUCH rather use any one of these planes than a wooden plane. They have perfectly matching blades, and set up precisely and easily.

Regards from Perth

Derek
Articles on furniture building, shop made tools and tool reviews at www.inthewoodshop.com
Reply
#16
Wedges wear out and it's quite possible the wedge you have isn't matched with your plane. So, first thing I'd check is the angle of the wedge compared to the plane body. You can sand a wedge to fit if it's too wide an angle, but if it's too narrow, you could either make a new wedge or create a wedged shim that can be glued to the existing wedge. A properly fit wedge shouldn't be too tight.

Another thing to look at is the flatness of where the blade beds against the plane body. You can do the chalk or carbon paper trick to see if there are spots that are out of flat. Then get a plane float or something similar to reprofile the bed area to get it flat - or work your blade if the blade isn't flat.
Still Learning,

Allan Hill
Reply
#17
So I sanded down the sides of the wedges, and that seemed to help, at least with the tongue plane.  I haven't played around a ton with adjusting it, but I was able to get the blade in, wedged, and it cuts well.  Might have just been lucky on setting it up this one time, but I'll take it so I can finish the project.  The groove plane's rear skate seems off.  I think I'm going to need to take it off and see what is wrong with how it is sitting/bedded on the side of the plane.  But, I have a plow plane, so easy workaround for now.

After successfully cutting the T&G joint I decided to add a bead.  Of course I think I sold my LV scratch stock tool years ago because I never used it.  Oops.
Rolleyes  Looked at the beading blade option for the LV plow, and realized I never did send that in to get remilled so I could use those blades.  So I grabbed a scraper and cut the profile I wanted.  Cut a slot in a piece of scrap, then was planning on adding a screw somehow to tighten the blade down.  Then I thought of a wedge, since I still had some scrap from my last project.  It worked.  Probably not as gracefully as an actual tool as the wedge was rather large, but I was worried about the wedge coming loose if I tried to saw the top off.  It is quite ugly though.

   

But it worked

   

Now I just need to apply the finish
   

Reply
#18
Nicely done: Looks great!
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)

Product Recommendations

Here are some supplies and tools we find essential in our everyday work around the shop. We may receive a commission from sales referred by our links; however, we have carefully selected these products for their usefulness and quality.