Vinyl Windows Peeling

[woodgrain]

Thanks for the replies. The biggest challenge will be to find a similar window that fits. This window problem was identified as part of a home inspection.

Is this a single window or is it systemic?  If its a single window, you could have it repaired. If it's multiple windows, repair would not be cost effective.  Our tub repair guy fixes cracked vinyl, acrylic and fiberglass -  he's an artist.  If you live near Portland Or, or SW Washington, I can get you his contact info (PM me)

[Snipe Hunter]

So what is a good window in your opinion??

As far as wood goes, I like Marvin and Andersen. I like Pella also but they're very difficult to deal with. If you want to get them repaired under warranty, you almost have to hire a lawyer and start a class action suit. Personally, I like Marvin the best but I really like Andersen's service and they make and warehouse parts for older windows.

There's a reason vinyl windows don't put their names on the products.

As far as vinyl windows go, I'd probably buy Mi windows. Back in the day they were called Metal Industries but they quit building aluminum windows a long time ago and changed their name to Mi. They are usually sold through building material suppliers. 84 Lumber sold them, not sure if they still do. I'd also consider Home Depot's American Craftsman. They own a large share in the company. They used to be complete junk before HD stepped in. Not really sure how good they are but HD isn't going out of business any time soon so I have someone to complain to. I've seen a lot of nice vinyls in home I inspect but rarely find  brand name on them. Vinyl extrusions are commercially available so just about anyone with a miter-saw and a glass supplier can go into the vinyl window business.

I wouldn't buy a vinyl window with mechanically joined corners. I'd only buy the welded corner window windows. They're basically welded with a hot plate. Get the ends hot and push them together.

I have "Castle" vinyl windows in my house, they seem ok. I believe they don't sell windows without installation.

One key to keeping vinyl windows in decent shape is to keep them latched. Particularly double hung windows. If you keep them latched, they won't distort so much. I see a lot of vinyl windows where the extrusions get so bent that they won't latch and won't slide up and down. The bent sashes will eventually cause the seal in the insulated glass to fail from stress.

If I were building a home, I'd specify Marvin or Andersen. I inspected a house today that all the Andersens replaced with vinyl except for 2 in the garage and 1 in a bathroom. The windows worked but the balances had gone bad. They could have been fixed. The house was built in 1981 so the Andersens are 37 years old. I've never seen operable 37 year old vinyl windows.

[jasfrank]

 The house was built in 1981 so the Andersens are 37 years old. I've never seen operable 37 year old vinyl windows.

I bought a house built in 53 in 1978. The windows had ran their course, so in 1980 I had all new vinyl windows from a company that also installed them. They are still working fine, and yes thats 37 years....
Within the first couple years a couple of the welded corners let loose and they came to repair them. After that I had to do my own repairs on them as the company went out of business. 
Not fancy or high priced, as the whole house of 28 windows was about 3500 bucks back then. Now they would want that much for just a couple of the bigger ones. In fact if I were to replace them all again it would probably exceed the value of the house. In 2004 I built another house and used Pella architect series windows and doors throughout. Installed them all myself. Just my observation and opinion, but I doubt they'll last as long as the cheap vinyl will.

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

As far as wood goes, I like Marvin and Andersen. I like Pella also but they're very difficult to deal with. If you want to get them repaired under warranty, you almost have to hire a lawyer and start a class action suit. Personally, I like Marvin the best but I really like Andersen's service and they make and warehouse parts for older windows.

There's a reason vinyl windows don't put their names on the products.

As far as vinyl windows go, I'd probably buy Mi windows. Back in the day they were called Metal Industries but they quit building aluminum windows a long time ago and changed their name to Mi. They are usually sold through building material suppliers. 84 Lumber sold them, not sure if they still do. I'd also consider Home Depot's American Craftsman. They own a large share in the company. They used to be complete junk before HD stepped in. Not really sure how good they are but HD isn't going out of business any time soon so I have someone to complain to. I've seen a lot of nice vinyls in home I inspect but rarely find  brand name on them. Vinyl extrusions are commercially available so just about anyone with a miter-saw and a glass supplier can go into the vinyl window business.

I wouldn't buy a vinyl window with mechanically joined corners. I'd only buy the welded corner window windows. They're basically welded with a hot plate. Get the ends hot and push them together.

I have "Castle" vinyl windows in my house, they seem ok. I believe they don't sell windows without installation.

One key to keeping vinyl windows in decent shape is to keep them latched. Particularly double hung windows. If you keep them latched, they won't distort so much. I see a lot of vinyl windows where the extrusions get so bent that they won't latch and won't slide up and down. The bent sashes will eventually cause the seal in the insulated glass to fail from stress.

If I were building a home, I'd specify Marvin or Andersen. I inspected a house today that all the Andersens replaced with vinyl except for 2 in the garage and 1 in a bathroom. The windows worked but the balances had gone bad. They could have been fixed. The house was built in 1981 so the Andersens are 37 years old. I've never seen operable 37 year old vinyl windows.

Thanks for the reply. Are these wood and vinyl clad or all vinyl windows you are talking about??  Do you have a series number on the Andersons?? I had Replacement by Anderson in last year to give me a price on all new windows including sliding door and picture window and it included 9 windows in my ranch house They are the people that use that composit material. The product which they showed was beautiful and looked well built but what kept me from pulling the trigger was the price $27,000 for all windows and the door. I also need a new roof and want siding on the house. I figured I can get both those for the price of what they wanted for the windows. So I am still looking now. Thus the questions.

[Roly]

Anderson's suggestion for repairing their vinyl clad wood windows.  LINK      Roly

[Snipe Hunter]

Pella, Andersen and Marvin are wood windows. Pella are aluminum clad, Andersen are vinyl clad and Marvin has several different exterior finishes from wood to fiberglass. If you are in a salt air environment (coastal) stay away from aluminum clad.

Andersen has a nice wood window already painted white on the inside. I probably would have bought those if HD still stocked them.

I just put in three Pella 450 windows in our master bedroom. I used Pella because Lowes still stocks them and I didn't want to pay the mark-up to order windows. They run about $70.00 more than a vinyl window. HD used to carry Andersen wood windows but not now, at least in this area.  Pella also has a real simple and inexpensive mull kit to join the windows together without adding support between their windows. The Pella 450 windows are not the same window you'd buy from a Pella store. They also have a fold out nailing flange which I really like. You can install them from the inside and push the window out past the flange and then fold it out and nail it in. My install was in a 2nd floor room so I was able to install the three windows mulled together and set it in place and then nail it in as opposed to doing all that work on a scaffold.

Pella uses spring loaded plastic tracks to hold their windows open. They don't slide as nice as Andersen or Marvin but it's a nice enough window at that price pint ... and available

I mulled these three together and slid it up the 2x4s, tilted it up in place and used the 2x4s to hold it in place while I went outside and nailed it in.







The old opening/window

[matthewstimp]

Responding LIL in here...I'm experiencing the same thing with several windows on our sun porch.  Vinyl clad windows (wood underneath), and the vinyl has peeled off in several places.  Windows are little more than 20 years old, previous owner had them installed at the time the room was added to the house, and I have no idea the manufacturer 

I'm trying to decide the best way to limp these things through a few more years.  Long term, I envision replacing all the windows in the house, but I'm probably 7-8 years away. 

So given that, what's the collective opinion on peeling off the loose vinyl and painting the wood underneath?  

Thanks,
Matt

[MstrCarpenter]

So given that, what's the collective opinion on peeling off the loose vinyl and painting the wood underneath?  

Thanks,
Matt

A really good primer followed with a really good top coat will last really long time. It's expensive, but considering the minimal square footage, and the time invested, getting the best is actually cost effective.

Our Church bell tower was restored last fall. They expect the paint to still be fully adhered for at least ten years. They used a Mad Dog primer that was sticky for two days; that was the top coat application window.

IMO Paint and primer in one is junk. Primer sticks to wood. Paint sticks to primer.

Reminds me of another quote from that cabinetmaking shop; Wax sticks to everything, nothing sticks to wax.

[Stwood_]

Vinyl Clad.......glue *will* eventually come loose.

[Snipe Hunter]

A really good primer followed with a really good top coat will last really long time. It's expensive, but considering the minimal square footage, and the time invested, getting the best is actually cost effective.

Our Church bell tower was restored last fall. They expect the paint to still be fully adhered for at least ten years. They used a Mad Dog primer that was sticky for two days; that was the top coat application window.

IMO Paint and primer in one is junk. Primer sticks to wood. Paint sticks to primer.

Reminds me of another quote from that cabinetmaking shop; Wax sticks to everything, nothing sticks to wax.

Good advice. There are some very durable exterior paints. I know Sherwin Williams has some real nice exterior enamels and lacquers. I'd visit a paint store for some professional help. Your paint is only as good as it's primer.