My Version of Christian Becksvoort's Dovetail Bench

[AHill]

I'm wading into dangerous waters perhaps, critcizing Becksvoort, who is FAR better a craftsman than myself.

I wonder if the height of Becksvoort's bench has more to do with his eyesight than ergonomics. To me, it seems to be so high as to be uncomfortable to use for sawing dovetails. You can see his arm is angled up, his elbow is splayed to the side from his body, and he's standing slightly at an angle to the bench. I don't think standing at an angle is necessarily bad, but in his case, it puts his saw hand farther away from the bench, which may be why his elbow is splayed out from his body.

But it's high enough that there's not much distance between his saw and his eyes - so maybe more of an attempt to get a closer view of what he's doing.

My vision of proper sawing stance is at around 9:40 in this video from Matt Estlea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5OzZNVGnXQ

[Mike Brady]

Christian Becksvoort is a rather tall man, as I remember from meeting him at a Lie-Nielsen Open House.  Probably 6'3", or so.  That might dictate increased height for his work surfaces.

[Philip1231]

I'm wading into dangerous waters perhaps, critcizing Becksvoort, who is FAR better a craftsman than myself.

I wonder if the height of Becksvoort's bench has more to do with his eyesight than ergonomics.  To me, it seems to be so high as to be uncomfortable to use for sawing dovetails.  You can see his arm is angled up, his elbow is splayed to the side from his body, and he's standing slightly at an angle to the bench.  I don't think standing at an angle is necessarily bad, but in his case, it puts his saw hand farther away from the bench, which may be why his elbow is splayed out from his body. 

But it's high enough that there's not much distance between his saw and his eyes - so maybe more of an attempt to get a closer view of what he's doing.

My vision of proper sawing stance is at around 9:40 in this video from Matt Estlea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5OzZNVGnXQ

There is no denying that this approach runs counter to tradition. Most of us have observed how the DT is traditionally cut, and in virtually all cases it involves holding or clamping the work at the bench, at the traditional bench height. Since the bench was generally used for all sorts of operations, including cutting DTs, its a compromise out of necessity. The height for rough planing may not be the best height for cutting DTs, and it may not even be the best height for drilling holes with a brace and bit. However, the woodworker is incredibly adaptable, and given the practical constraints that impact the work environment, not the least of which is space and $$$, the current tradition of stooping over to cut DTs at the traditional bench height prevails.

CB cuts lots of DTs. And I suspect he could produce very nice dovetails regardless of the height: he is that good. However, I think he saw a way to make the work holding method adapt to him, rather than the other way around, to his advantage. I think this is something you have to experience, and that is why I built a prototype out of cheap (at least used to be) construction lumber as a proof of principle experiment. This approach may not be for everyone and if you are comfortable cutting DTs the traditional way, I certainly won’t stand in your way. But if you are even a bit curious about the merits of this approach, I would suggest that you cobble something together and give it a try.

[Philip1231]

Christian Becksvoort is a rather tall man, as I remember from meeting him at a Lie-Nielsen Open House.  Probably 6'3", or so.  That might dictate increased height for his work surfaces.

And if I recall correctly, he left out the detail of how high his bench was: I believe to reinforce the idea that it is specific to each individual woodworker, taking into consideration their height.

[bandit571]

Usually...I am sitting down at the bench, on a shop stool....not just for sawing dovetails....but 90% of all the chisel work....including mortises...is done sitting down...

BTW:  I am 5' 10-1/2" tall....top of the bench is 34" high....

[Philip1231]

I noticed the same thing Pedder. Wonder how craftsmen survived for centuries without these things.

I had a blacksmiths post vise in my shop that I sometimes used for detail work. My workbench is palm height, my blacksmith vise is just below elbow height. I would think that would be the highest you would want something like that.

Phillip, where is this bench compared to your elbow?

Adam: the top of the bench on bench is 44-1/2" above the floor. My elbow is around 48". I suspect, although I am not certain, that there is an optimum height for the various tasks performed at a joiners bench. e.g., if you were to create a workspace where there was a "planing bench", a "brace and bit" bench, a "dovetailing bench", an "inlay/intarsia" bench, etc., I suspect that none of these benches would be the same height. The point of CBs FWW article was to point out that what we have come to accept as the "right" height for a work bench might not be as "right" for some tasks as it is for others, and that one way around that is to augment the existing bench with an auxiliary bench better suited for a specific task. Phil

[Pedder]

Thanks for the medaillon Story! Now you will have to make black pads on all of your pieces.

Cheers
Pedder

[Cian]

Looks functional and beautiful!